It's already been proven that factoring accuracy into BP doesn't work, you might survive an 80 BP attack, but not an 100 BP attack. The only place this is works is for probabilities of a OHKO/2HKO, which is why you hear that Gengar has a 49% chance of 2HKOing Blissey instead of a 100% chance. However, everytime Focus Blast hits Blissey its a 120 BP SE attack.
-
The moderators of this forum can be found in the CAP forum staff directory.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
CAP 3 CAP 3 - Part 9.5 (Main/Secondary Ability Poll)
- Thread starter Gothic Togekiss
- Start date
- Status
Right, and I've always found that multiplying the BP on a hit, times the chance to hit, gives a good approximation as to the damage-potential of a move.
rock head
solar power
what did greenhouse do?
solar power
what did greenhouse do?
GreenHouse - Upon switching in, user cast a Sunny Day effect for five turns. The effect from it's ability are not effected by Dry Rock (I'm assuming that what Doug wanted before it was taken down)
All the other "stall/defensive-type" abilities would play a much more prominent role in breaking the Pokemon. Here's why:
D/P is the most offensive metagame yet, and I think a lot of people can agree on that, especially those who have experience in the previous generations. It is not often that the conventional usefulness of Pressure comes to play because the games are generally much shorter than other metagames. As such, the Leech Seed with Pressure tactics that you mention only truly come to play in those long battles.
Abilities like Battle Armor and Leaf Guard are protecting the Pokemon from things that inevitably happen every game, or at least more frequently than "PP burning." The critical hit can happen on any single turn in the battle, and turning that chance to defeat one of the best defensive Pokemon into void is what makes it so displeasing to my eyes. While Leaf Guard does only protect from status if the sun is out, that is no stopping anyone from setting a sunny day up themselves to keep this Pokemon invulnerable.
Then, there's abilities such as Sniper and Rock Head. The problem with these abilities is that it adds little to the overall usefulness of the Pokemon.
Simply put, Pressure is the least broken and most usable (on average) of them all.
Rock Head effectively allows it to run a Mixed or even Physical attacking set, and you think "it adds little to the overall usefulness of the Pokemon"? I would argue that the early parts of your post actually prove that Pressure does little to nothing for Woodman.
Actually Stall, a mixed set on this pokemon is indeed pretty much useless. The only pokemon i can see any physical attack from Woodman actually outdamaging a special attack would be Blissey.
Physical walls already receive more damage from the Special Attacks. Any other Special Wall used atm, like Togekiss, Revenankh, Tentacreul, Cresselia, wouldn't even receive extra significant amount of damage from a physical move used by woodman anyways. Thus Rock Head is indeed an extremely useless ability.
Prove me wrong please, becuase like i said earlier, i just simply dont get it.
Physical walls already receive more damage from the Special Attacks. Any other Special Wall used atm, like Togekiss, Revenankh, Tentacreul, Cresselia, wouldn't even receive extra significant amount of damage from a physical move used by woodman anyways. Thus Rock Head is indeed an extremely useless ability.
Prove me wrong please, becuase like i said earlier, i just simply dont get it.
Rock Head...it makes it a little better on the physical side, but will it still be usable? It seems like Rock Head is one of the contenders at the moment, so I'll throw another prediction onto the table: you'll find out quickly that although its physical side is great for novelty, it's not much good at anything else. This is especially true because of the balance problems of adding flavor to its movepool along the lines of such attacks as Rock Slide, Stone Edge, and Earthquake.
It can be argued that Pressure is...useless, but it can also be defended. Well, this Pokemon is defensive. How could it not use Pressure? Comparing it to Calm Zapdos, it could easily match up against a Blissey and win 1on1, especially with Pressure.
EDIT: Thanks, 3N3MY. :)
It can be argued that Pressure is...useless, but it can also be defended. Well, this Pokemon is defensive. How could it not use Pressure? Comparing it to Calm Zapdos, it could easily match up against a Blissey and win 1on1, especially with Pressure.
EDIT: Thanks, 3N3MY. :)
But Zapdos has a Stats rating of 580, Fantastic, whilst Woodman has one of 396. [/ever quoting X-Acts stats thing].
Simple thing is, Woodman's bulkier then Zapdos. We'd be giving it the ability to stall BETTER THAN IT ALREADY DOES. if we were to give it Pressure, we'd have to take away from the movepool so much it would be shallower than Aldaron's personality, thus ruining Woodman. If your claiming that Rock Head is useless, then that's for the better then: Give this a good ability, with stats and movepool, and you've got uber material. Think Deoxys that is not Tank: They've all got pressure. Useless except for the Tank. However, if you were to give it something else that was better, it'd be too good for ubers (lol). IIRC this thing can already fuck bliss up with SubSeed, so we don't need to give it pressure just to shit on her grave AND make it better then Cresselia at mixed walling due to being able to stall.
Simple thing is, Woodman's bulkier then Zapdos. We'd be giving it the ability to stall BETTER THAN IT ALREADY DOES. if we were to give it Pressure, we'd have to take away from the movepool so much it would be shallower than Aldaron's personality, thus ruining Woodman. If your claiming that Rock Head is useless, then that's for the better then: Give this a good ability, with stats and movepool, and you've got uber material. Think Deoxys that is not Tank: They've all got pressure. Useless except for the Tank. However, if you were to give it something else that was better, it'd be too good for ubers (lol). IIRC this thing can already fuck bliss up with SubSeed, so we don't need to give it pressure just to shit on her grave AND make it better then Cresselia at mixed walling due to being able to stall.
I fail to see how pressure could be useless on poke with 120 hp and possibly get leech seed.
I could run sub,protect,leech seed and random move.Sit and stall the crap out stuff.
Well, firstly, I don't get your reasoning in proving that Zapdos has a better stats rating than Woodman. ?_? Mathematics is probably worse than theory at proving a Pokemon's competitive ability (in theory, heh). Well, you voted for Battle Armor. What is it that makes you choose Battle Armor (an ability that effects the Pokemon the entire battle) over Pressure (an ability whose potential is only unlocked during pure stall battles)? You argue that Pressure is too useful, but what about Battle Armor?
@ Luck: What? I argued that Pressure was not useless. I think your target is Stall?
I know it's an example, but that is probably one of the worst sets you could possibly come up with, especially in "pure stall." :x
@ Luck: What? I argued that Pressure was not useless. I think your target is Stall?
I know it's an example, but that is probably one of the worst sets you could possibly come up with, especially in "pure stall." :x
Lol Aki, I don't even know if anyone here takes you seriously anymore :X
Anyway, I'm reiterating my support for Pressure...
I am also second guessing my support for Scrappy, so I'll put some thought into it before I decide.
I'd prefer if we did build a Pokemon for the Scrappy Rapid Spin combo, not just to kind of throw it on arbitrarily.
Anyway, I'm reiterating my support for Pressure...
I am also second guessing my support for Scrappy, so I'll put some thought into it before I decide.
I'd prefer if we did build a Pokemon for the Scrappy Rapid Spin combo, not just to kind of throw it on arbitrarily.
My bad,I saw useless and got carried away.
As for in terms of purely bad stalling sets.All this set needs is something it can set up on and a pokemon exist that it can set up on constantly a poke named "Blissey"
Well, nice to see that the greenhouse issue's been resolved.
I'ma vote Leaf Guard and Battle Armor.
I'ma vote Leaf Guard and Battle Armor.
How can you guys seriously say Rock Head would be useless. Rock Head would be useless? How? 120 Base Power moves both with great STAB so you don't let Blissey and Snorlax stand in your way. Or for the simple fact that they have 100 accuracy, while Fire Blast has 85 accuracy. Grass Knot isn't always 120 Base Power and Solar Beam needs Sunny Day to work effectively. Wood Hammer also seems like a better option to hit Tyranitar, Vaporeon and Starmie with, rather than use Grass Knot. All of them are also viable Pokemon in OU. So you calling Rock Head more useless than Pressure is bullshit. Being able to KILL opposing Pokemon ( Rock Head ) rather than STALL ( Pressure ) seems like like the more useful trait. It just seems your trying to make Suicune all over again but with a different goal for the team. We all know how broken Suicune was in ADV as well. Anyway Karrot, if Rock Head is so useless and Pressure is so useful why do i see no more than 5 people drooling and dwelling over Pressure and probably about 25-30 people choosing Rock Head? Or are we all blind and ignorant and not realizing that Pressure is the better choice?
except suicune was never broken in advance.
Being nearly invincible after Calm Mind = Broken
The answer to that question is Yes
120 Hp,105 defense, 90 Spdef
or
70 att 60 speed
Woodsman is a defensive poke and is set up to make better use of pressure than it would Rock head physical recoil moves.I vote sheep vote of battle armor and rock head because thats what other people want but pressure would make it a better poke.
The physcial and special split hurt Suicune.In could wall on both in side R/S it can't now.It can be bombed on physcial side with physcial grass moves where in R/S grass moves was only special.
- Status