SM OU Spikes Greninja and Rocks Clefable + Fightinum-Z Kartana Balance

Who is your favourite OU rocks setter?


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  • Poll closed .
Hey, Jay back with another team. I only just made and experimented this team so it definitely needs some work, posted it here to see if you helpful people can make this better. This team involves the hazard-setting Greninja + Clefable core and more. Hope you like this!

I wanted to make a team around Kartana since it is a big threat in the metagame and i still wonder why it looks like a piece of origami shit that resists spike and rock hazards, i mean, it looks so thin. At smogon i found out Kartana needs some good hazard setters so that where Clefable and Greninja came in. I reckon Greninja with Expert Belt could've done some damage and killed some mons on the opposing team for me, with setting up a bit of spikes along the way as well. But i thought, what if greninja got killed very easily before even setting up a few spikes?. That's where Clefable came in. Clefable was always a great rock setter to me and i reckon its ability could reflect some more hazards back to the opponent. At the very moment i put Clefable onto the team, i knew i needed some kind of anti-steel mon. And the one who does that job very well is no other than: PIKACHU! Magnezone. Magnezone's ability Magnet Pull kills steel types in like an instant, and when i first experimented this team, Magnezone with assault vest lost to Protect + Seeds Celesteela so i decided to put specs on it for extra power and it worked. Now Magnezone gets rid of steel types for me, so i decided to put in 'mons that destroy teams when steel types are gone. The first mon i thought of was: Pikachu (okay enough with the Pikachu jokes) Aerilate Mega Pinsir. Mega Pinsir DESTROYS teams with Aerilate + SD. Close Combat, Quick Attack, and Frustration are the moves to kill literally anything besides from fire types (which will be dealt with greninja and rocks). The final 'mon i thought of was support Togekiss, since it has wish and heal bell and Serene Grace which annoys the opponent. Since Togekiss' biggest threat which are steel types that are destroyed by Magnezone, it can be switched in safely and heal up the team.


Kartana - Sweeper

Kartana's ability to kill many other threats in the OU metagame made me want to use this guy a LOT. Its resistances to rocks makes it a great defogger as well. SD makes Kartana a boss, and Kartana's ability just makes it better. When you kill a mon with either a Z-Move or a normal move after SD, 2.5x Atk to Kartana. Another mon, 3x attack. It just keeps on going.

Greninja - Hazard Setter + Fire Extinguisher

Greninja's spikes just made me put it on this team to support Kartana. Protean made Greninja much more unpredictable. Greninja covers like the entire team against fire-types with Hydro Pump. Gets rid of Tangrowth and Dragons with Ice Beam, and due the anti-fairy job given to Magnezone, it leaves an extra space for Dark Pulse for Mew and other psychic threats.

Clefable - Anti-Dragon / Fighting + Rocks Setter

To make the opponent easier to sweep, i thought a stealth rock setter would be nice. But i needed something to get rid of Fighting and Dragon types for the team. BAM! Clefable came to mind. With its STAB Moonblast and the ability to set rocks, it was the perfect pokemon for my team. Clefable also acts as a back-up hazard setter in case Greninja dies too early.

Magnezone - Glue of the team

Magnezone is truly the glue of the team since literally the entire team relies on Magnezone to get rid of Steel threats which will destroy the entire team. The whole entire team can lure steel types in and that's magnezone's chance to kill them with HP Fire. Magnezone gets rid of steel types to let the other mons come in safely and sweep like HELL!

Mega-Pinsir - Late Game Sweeper

When it is late in the game, Mega Pinsir comes in after the opposing team has been weakened and SD sweeps the entire opposing team with Frustration and Close Combat (Quick Attack for priority). Mega Pinsir covers greninja and magnezone from fighting types.

Latios - Scarfer / Revenge Killer (suggested by HQuaze)

Latios is a great scarfer and can outspeed most threats in the metagame. Since Mega Charizard X is a big problem since it can OHKO Gastrodon, Magnezone, Clefable, Kartana, and MPinsir with a DD already done. Latios can still outspeed one or two DD MCharizard X and kill it with Draco Meteor. Latios' speed makes it a great defogger as well.

Gastrodon - Water Drainer / SpD Wall (suggested by
Gastrodon's SpD makes it a great SpD wall. Its ability makes it immune to water, and its typing makes it immune to electric. This guy is my mag, heat, and tox check.


Origami Shit (Kartana) @ Darkinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sacred Sword
- Leaf Blade
- Night Slash

GRRR!!! (Pinsir-Mega) @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance

A Fable (Clefable) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off

Steel Sucker (Magnezone) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Happiness: 0
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]

DAFLASH (Latios) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Trick

Bluey (Gastrodon-East) @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Earthquake


Team V 1.0 (by me)
Team V 2.0 (HQuaze)
Team V 2.5 (added nicks and changed Kartana, PrideMustang)
 
Last edited:
Solid team. I arent a team rater or anything, just wanna point out that in the section "The Team" you said that Togekiss has a x4 weakness to Steel, but thats not true.
 

Breezy

formerly Quaze
is a Top Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion

Hey JayThePokemaster alias The Pikachu Lover
you saw right, kartana is a big threat in the current metagame and people ignore it’s coverage and fire power because it seems defensively so weak. i really like the offensive core mag-kartana-mpinsir but in my opinion it can be supported better. also there are some questionable sets that reveal to be useless ingame.
i’ve found a big weakness to greninja, tapu lele, ddance zygarde, charizard mega x/y and tapu koko which can be fixed by switching togekiss and greninja which are otherways dead slots.

your togekiss cleric set is surclassed by the common clefable’s cleric set. not only for the typing but also for the ability. although in this team neither of them is good. greninja is well known for its coverage and movepool, giving it spikes, stabs and ice beam makes your greninja walled by tapu fini, chansey and ferrothorn. with expert bell you will deal 0 damage to anybody. next time give a look to the smogon articles about the viable sets.
http://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/togekiss/ou/
http://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/greninja/

i’d suggest you firstly to replace these last two mentioned slots with choice scarfed
and special defensive
. latios gives you a revenge killer for greninja-ash form, dragon dance zygarde and a weakened tapu koko. it’s also your charizard mega x and y’s check. gastrodon is your electric immunity and it’s also a good magearna, heatran and toxapex check.
Latios @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Trick
Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Earthquake
lastly you should change the
spread and rivisit the evs of your
. clef doesn’t need that much special attack investement because it works better as physical wall. flamethrower is pointless having magnezone, knock off here is way more useful. i’d give magnezone enough speed to outspeed mega scizor and the rest of the evs in hp for more bulk to check better tapu lele. tapu lele in will still remain a threat but you can definetely play around it.
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Happiness: 0
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]
the rest of the team is fine but have you considered to put night slash with darknium z on
over either defog or sacred sword? this would help you to break mew, venusaur mega, offensive zapdos and stuff like that. other change you could make is giving earthquaze on
for magearna.
Kartana @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog / Smart Strike
- Sacred Sword
Kartana @ Darkium z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog / Sacred Sword
- Night Slash / Defog
Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance
Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance
the team now is really solid and every slot has it’s utility. i hope i’ve helped you and have fun using this team! :]

Kartana @ Fightinium Z / Darkium z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog
- Sacred Sword / Night Slash

Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake / Close Combat
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off

Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Happiness: 0
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Latios @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Trick

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Earthquake

  • threats
  • changes
  • other possible changes
 
Last edited:

Hey JayThePokemaster alias The Pikachu Lover
you saw right, kartana is a big threat in the current metagame and people ignore it’s coverage and fire power because it seems defensively so weak. i really like the offensive core mag-kartana-mpinsir but in my opinion it can be supported better. also there are some questionable sets that reveal to be useless ingame.
i’ve found a big weakness to greninja, tapu lele, ddance zygarde, charizard mega x/y and tapu koko which can be fixed by switching togekiss and greninja which are otherways dead slots.

your togekiss cleric set is surclassed by the common clefable’s cleric set. not only for the typing but also for the ability. although in this team neither of them is good. greninja is well known for its coverage and movepool, giving it spikes, stabs and ice beam makes your greninja walled by tapu fini, chansey and ferrothorn. with expert bell you will deal 0 damage to anybody. next time give a look to the smogon articles about the viable sets.
http://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/togekiss/ou/
http://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/greninja/

i’d suggest you firstly to replace these last two mentioned slots with choice scarfed
and special defensive
. latios gives you a revenge killer for greninja-ash form, dragon dance zygarde and a weakened tapu koko. it’s also your charizard mega x and y’s check. gastrodon is your electric immunity and it’s also a good magearna, heatran and toxapex check.
Latios @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Trick
Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Earthquake
lastly you should change the
spread and rivisit the evs of your
. clef doesn’t need that much special attack investement because it works better as physical wall. flamethrower is pointless having magnezone, knock off here is way more useful. i’d give magnezone enough speed to outspeed mega scizor and the rest of the evs in hp for more bulk to check better tapu lele. tapu lele in will still remain a threat but you can definetely play around it.
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Happiness: 0
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]
the rest of the team is fine but have you considered to put night slash with darknium z on
over either defog or sacred sword? this would help you to break mew, venusaur mega, offensive zapdos and stuff like that. other change you could make is giving earthquaze on
for magearna.
Kartana @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog / Smart Strike
- Sacred Sword
Kartana @ Darkium z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog / Sacred Sword
- Night Slash / Defog
Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance
Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance
the team now is really solid and every slot has it’s utility. i hope i’ve helped you and have fun using this team! :]

Kartana @ Fightinium Z / Darkium z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Defog
- Sacred Sword / Night Slash

Pinsir-Mega @ Pinsirite
Ability: Aerilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake / Close Combat
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Swords Dance

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off

Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Happiness: 0
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Latios @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Trick

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Earthquake

  • threats
  • changes
  • other possible changes
Hey thanks for the suggestions, i will be sure to change my team! The changes all make sense.
But i just can't decide to put Darkium Z Night Slash or Fightinum Z Sacred Sword on my Kartana. Should i replace Leaf Blade with Sacred Sword but keep Night Slash and the Darkium Z or Fightinum Z?
 
I would use Night Slash (with Darkinium Z) + Leaf Blade + Smart Strike/Sacred Sword. This team struggles with Zapdos, you can lure that mon with Dark Z and KO it, making the life of M-Pinsir easier, and since you have Zone to trap most Fight Z targets, you don't need it at all.
I also suggest you stick with the changes HQuaze suggested before.
Good luck :)
 
I agree with all above changes, but I would say that specs probably isn't the best option on zone. With AV instead, you can use zone as a bulky pivot, which is extremely helpful. Also, if a celesteela/ferrothorn is troubling you with leech seed, don't be an idiot and stay in. Volt switch out of there. You can run specs if you want, but personally I don't think they are extremely necessary here.
 

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