SPOILERS! Scarlet & Violet Leaks Thread - Data/Mechanics

I think the only great user of Protean / Libero now is Cinderace. The main STAB its using, Pyro Ball, doesn't change its typing, so its follow-up U-Turn on one of its counters like Hippowdon and Slowbro will still be doing extra damage.

For Meowscarada and Greninja, I think its usefulness will mostly be limited to Choice sets.
Well you forget the best user who can use Sword Dance with it.
:ss/Kecleon:
If it had Sword Dance at least
 
I'm surprised they leaned so hard into realism with these legendaries being ridden and fought with after gens 6 and 7 worked out solutions to this and the story explicitly established they're not unique species; the only time we've had a main mon actually tied to your game like this was LGPE. It's less convenient, but it *does* add to immersion in terms of "why can I only selectively sic my legendary on people". I think I like it tbh, even if I was hoping to just trade my spare Miraidon for my friend's Koraidon without losing the Miraidon I have for personal use later.

I guess we'll probably get events giving them out as shinies by the time the generation is done anyway.
 
Maybe, but last I checked Cinderace didn't do any of this, and all it did was (if even) click Bulk Up, and then either click highest damage or click U-turn and say bye, with very very rarely Court Change being used.
With Greninja's main perk in gen 7-8natdex not being Protean shenenigan themselves, but rather the fact you'd not know if it's Protean or BattleBond (also nerfed), as both had different checks, and a mispredict could cost you the game.

Ofc the protean nerf takes out a chunk of the utility of the Protean skill to begin with, but it doesn't change the fact that you do get the juicy stab-uturn and stab-insertcoverage damage.

I don't quite recall any real case in singles (or even doubles) where you'd use protean defensively to tank hits at all.

Smh, Lati@s could easily come from the other side of the planet at the sound of a flute, the new dragons are really weak.
I mean the official Smogon Ban Announcement said: "it can even utilize Libero as its name is intended, giving Cinderace the ability to change its typing to withstand a potentially fatal attack."
So I do believe that Protean's flexibility is why its so strong. Just being a generic STAB granter once per send-out is rather one note. Not bad, just predictable.

I feel like Cinder was banned more because of Pyroball + Protean. It was a lot of damage with basically no downside and a chance to burn, and Protean/Liberio didn't even effect that because its already a Fire type. I don't think Choicing it was as popular as just using boots either so I'm not sure that's going to be enough this ability as being toptier. The official ban announcement also talked about how Cinder "could" have been chipped down via rocks if boots weren't being run on it in most games, so Choice+Lib/Protean didn't seem like it was key to the success of the ability.

I think people are gonna spam the hell out of the cat for a few weeks and then when the dust settles it'll end up being used "some of the time." instead of being a must have on every team like Protean/Liberio users of the past.
 
By the way, are Roaring Moon/Iron Valiant one-offs?
I know the other paradoxes are plentiful, but those 2 in particular seem to have more importance put on them. 590 BST, they're separated from the others in the regional dex
 
By the way, are Roaring Moon/Iron Valiant one-offs?
I know the other paradoxes are plentiful, but those 2 in particular seem to have more importance put on them. 590 BST, they're separated from the others in the regional dex
No, they have normal encounters in the table. Both have a global rate of 50% (?), and a biome rate of 5%/1%.
 
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With confirmation of how the dice works (seeming to remove 2 and 3 rolls) I'll say I've looked over all the multihit moves and there are precious few people that might want to use an item slot for it (multiple moves or decent ability). Chesnaught has access to bullet seed being a 100-125 stab with no recoil and pin missile as well, though the typing on that seems kinda niche. Breloom's technician works well with it making a very strong bullet seed. And of course the winner is Heracross, with all the multihit moves it learned for it's mega only to be abandoned. This would give you a moxie (or guts I guess) heracross with 100-125 bp attacks of pin missile, bullet seed, and rock blast. Honorable mention of forretress with pin missile and rock blast, and really anything that has rock blast to replace stone edge for something with better accuracy and a higher damage ceiling. It's too bad cinccino didn't come back this time with it's technician.
 
Skeledirge feels like it would have potential in Monotype, where being a Fire-type with recovery that doesn't have a double weakness is an uncommon niche.
 
Plot twist, I come from the future and people discovered the new gamebreaking Color Change tank set!

It's true I swear COPIUM
Speaking of Kecleon. It's one of the last Gen 2 pokemon to not get anything to help its sorry state. Most single stages now have evolutions, and Delibird at least has a paradox. Kecleon is just out here kekking.
 
By the way, are Roaring Moon/Iron Valiant one-offs?
I know the other paradoxes are plentiful, but those 2 in particular seem to have more importance put on them. 590 BST, they're separated from the others in the regional dex
No. The 4Chan Q/A thread outright confirms it in the OP that you can get multiple and they're not shiny-locked either. Roaring Moon's shiny is the same weird green as Salamence.

No, they have normal encounters in the table. Both have a global rate of 50% (?), and a biome rate of 5%/1%.
Now that's odd.

Basically, what I've heard is that they're easy to find, as long as you know where to find them. Usually only one spawns in the area at a time. Maybe these odds are how GF did that?

Speaking of Kecleon. It's one of the last Gen 2 pokemon to not get anything to help its sorry state. Most single stages now have evolutions, and Delibird at least has a paradox. Kecleon is just out here kekking.
I know Kecleon is so bad it looks like a Gen 2 mon, but it isn't. :totodiLUL:
 
Speaking of Kecleon. It's one of the last Gen 2 pokemon to not get anything to help its sorry state. Most single stages now have evolutions, and Delibird at least has a paradox. Kecleon is just out here kekking.
What do you mean, Kecleon is infamous for being the hardest Mystery Dungeon boss of all time :)

Memes aside, I'm not really sure Kecleon is popular enough to ever get buffed or even considered.

It is true that Dunsparce finally got a evo and Delibird got a 2.0 form, but both of these are basically rolling jokes amongst the fanbase so they have a certain degree of popularity.

No. The 4Chan Q/A thread outright confirms it in the OP that you can get multiple and they're not shiny-locked either. Roaring Moon's shiny is the same weird green as Salamence.
I wonder if we have ways to confirm this... maybe the pokemon tables have the shiny chances?

Basically, what I've heard is that they're easy to find, as long as you know where to find them. Usually only one spawns in the area at a time. Maybe these odds are how GF did that?
Maybe they are static spawns? There's a bunch of them, mainly the Tera fights that aren't raid, so may work similarly?
 
Speaking of Kecleon. It's one of the last Gen 2 pokemon to not get anything to help its sorry state. Most single stages now have evolutions, and Delibird at least has a paradox. Kecleon is just out here kekking.
Did Sudowoodo get anything notable besides like Trailblaze?
 
I wonder if we have ways to confirm this... maybe the pokemon tables have the shiny chances?
The screenshot for Roaring Moon looked believable enough and I've seen one go nuts in a thread because they had found a shiny Scream Tail. The rest of the anons told them to battle it before it was gone and multiple screenshots showing the battle were posted.

I think it's safe to say that since you can catch multiple Paradox mons, they're not shiny-locked. Is there precedent of mons like these being shiny-locked? How did the Ultra Beasts work?
 
Oof and I was thinking about trading the extra box legendary for a Koraidon too. Not sure if I will want to play through again especially so soon after doing it once. I guess I will throw something up on the GTS when it comes time and hope someone who doesn't know trades their Koraidon. :worrywhirl:

Edit: Or just wait for a event where they give away a shiny or non shiny version of your opposite legendary like they did for Sword and Shield.
 
The screenshot for Roaring Moon looked believable enough and I've seen one go nuts in a thread because they had found a shiny Scream Tail. The rest of the anons told them to battle it before it was gone and multiple screenshots showing the battle were posted.

I think it's safe to say that since you can catch multiple Paradox mons, they're not shiny-locked. Is there precedent of mons like these being shiny-locked? How did the Ultra Beasts work?
Ultra Beasts in Sun & Moon were shiny locked, even the ones who showed up in 2s or 4s.
The old Ultra Beasts in USUM were not shiny locked. The new ones were, even though you caught two of each.
 
No. The 4Chan Q/A thread outright confirms it in the OP that you can get multiple and they're not shiny-locked either. Roaring Moon's shiny is the same weird green as Salamence.


Now that's odd.

Basically, what I've heard is that they're easy to find, as long as you know where to find them. Usually only one spawns in the area at a time. Maybe these odds are how GF did that?



I know Kecleon is so bad it looks like a Gen 2 mon, but it isn't. :totodiLUL:
After looking at it a bit more, I think I may understand how the rates work now.

The global rate is used for the specified area - in this case, in The Great Crater of Paldea, Roaring Moon and Iron Valiant have a 50% encounter rate.
The biome rate is used globally throughout the map, so:
- Roaring Moon has a 5% chance to appear in a "Cave" biome, and a 1% chance to appear in a "Underground" biome.
- Iron Valiant has a 5% chance to appear in a "Cave" biome, and a 1% chance to appear in a "Underground" biome.
This is so long as you have the flag FSYS_SCENARIO_GAME_CLEAR within your save data set to true.

Though, if this is truly the case, that means that the following paradox Pokemon are available before beating the game:
Code:
Scream Tail
Flutter Mane
Iron Jugulis
Iron Bundle
So I'm not sure how accurate that is.
 
So I'm not sure how accurate that is.
It does sound accurate, though it surprises me that the Donpharadoxes are not available before beating the game.

...Also, the question that follows is... what spawns are actually locked to postgame? (aka, assuminly, require that flag)?
 
According to Reddit there is an NPC trade where you trade a Pinchurchin for a Haunter.

The Haunter is not holding an Everstone.
Mandatory "Fuck Mindy".

Also, terrible, terrible news for Normal-types...

Now this was interesting: Tera Blast is only ever a 80 BP special Normal-type move before you Tera, it's not until after that it has the possibility to use a potentially higher Attack stat to calculate its damage. I will test later if it always targets the SpDef tho after you Tera.
This can't be happening... Just... No way.

Wait, where is the Tera Blast TM anyway? I haven't seen anyone mention where you can get it anywhere yet.

After looking at it a bit more, I think I may understand how the rates work now.

The global rate is used for the specified area - in this case, in The Great Crater of Paldea, Roaring Moon and Iron Valiant have a 50% encounter rate.
The biome rate is used globally throughout the map, so:
- Roaring Moon has a 5% chance to appear in a "Cave" biome, and a 1% chance to appear in a "Underground" biome.
- Iron Valiant has a 5% chance to appear in a "Cave" biome, and a 1% chance to appear in a "Underground" biome.
This is so long as you have the flag FSYS_SCENARIO_GAME_CLEAR within your save data set to true.

Though, if this is truly the case, that means that the following paradox Pokemon are available before beating the game:
Code:
Scream Tail
Flutter Mane
Iron Jugulis
Iron Bundle
So I'm not sure how accurate that is.
We're diving DEEP into spoiler territory here, so buckle up!

So basically, you only unlock the big dog paradoxes after the final boss. Before that, you get to catch only some of them.

Obviously, the Paradox Donphans are available even earlier as Totems, but Roaring Moon is essentially post-post-game. Geez.

I don't get the 50% thing at all though. Is there a similar example outside of The Crater so we can openly discuss it? (And hopefully have more knowledge on it?)
 

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