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SPOILERS! Mysteries and Conspiracies of Pokemon
- Thread starter stage7_4
- Start date
I wonder which Pokemon were up for consideration. If Psyduck was being considered guess there was really no restriction since they weren't going to evolve anyway. So that said I could also see Sandshrew, Clefairy, Vulpix, Jigglypuff, Meowth, Growlithe, & Cubone. However in the end I think Eevee makes the most sense. For one thing, it was your rival's Starter in Yellow so for the alternate version just swap them! Also, while this was probably a later decision, what would the special Tutor moves be for the other Pokemon? For Pikachu and Eevee it was easy: Surfing and Balloon Pikachu are well known imagery while Eevee you give it a move representing its evolutions.
Sandshrew: Maybe rolling attacks that afflict a status ailment. Example: Static Roll (Electric-type & paralyzes, handles Water weakness), Toxic Roll (Poison-type & poisons, handles Grass weakness), Rocky Roll (Rock-type & flinches, handles Ice weakness).
Clefairy: Maybe dancing based moves which then increase a stat? Mindful Dance (Psychic-type & ups SpA & SpD, handles Poison weakness), Passionate Dance (Fire-type & ups Spe, handles Steel weakness)
Vulpix: Maybe give it 6 moves, one for each tail and relates to a Kitsune power? Nature Tail (Grass-type & drains, handles all its weaknesses), Illusion Tail (Ghost-type & ups Evasion), Storm Tail (Flying-type & levitates off ground)
Jigglypuff: Well this would be singing moves and be song versions of Clefairy's special moves, though instead of stat increases it causes stat decreases to target. Mindful Song (Psychic-type & lowers Atk & Def), Passionate Song (Fire-type & lowers Def & SpD)
Meowth: Scratching moves and, since it's Meowth maybe have luck & trickery effects. Gusty Scratch (Flying-type & high crit, handles Fighting weakness), Shadow Scratch (Ghost-type & can't miss), Rocket Scratch (Steel-type & +1 priority)
Growlithe: Biting moves I guess, and maybe it can increase its Stats while also decreasing target's. Drool Bite (Water-type & drains, handles Ground & Rock weaknesses), Shock Bite (Electric-type & ups Spe/lowers Spe, handles Water weakness)
Cubone: Clubbing moves which can afflict status ailment or stat decrease. Tangle Club (Grass-type & traps, handles Water weakness), Swarm Club (Bug-type & Flinch, handles Grass-type), Crush Club (Fighting-type & lowers Def, handles Ice weakness)
Clefairy: Maybe dancing based moves which then increase a stat? Mindful Dance (Psychic-type & ups SpA & SpD, handles Poison weakness), Passionate Dance (Fire-type & ups Spe, handles Steel weakness)
Vulpix: Maybe give it 6 moves, one for each tail and relates to a Kitsune power? Nature Tail (Grass-type & drains, handles all its weaknesses), Illusion Tail (Ghost-type & ups Evasion), Storm Tail (Flying-type & levitates off ground)
Jigglypuff: Well this would be singing moves and be song versions of Clefairy's special moves, though instead of stat increases it causes stat decreases to target. Mindful Song (Psychic-type & lowers Atk & Def), Passionate Song (Fire-type & lowers Def & SpD)
Meowth: Scratching moves and, since it's Meowth maybe have luck & trickery effects. Gusty Scratch (Flying-type & high crit, handles Fighting weakness), Shadow Scratch (Ghost-type & can't miss), Rocket Scratch (Steel-type & +1 priority)
Growlithe: Biting moves I guess, and maybe it can increase its Stats while also decreasing target's. Drool Bite (Water-type & drains, handles Ground & Rock weaknesses), Shock Bite (Electric-type & ups Spe/lowers Spe, handles Water weakness)
Cubone: Clubbing moves which can afflict status ailment or stat decrease. Tangle Club (Grass-type & traps, handles Water weakness), Swarm Club (Bug-type & Flinch, handles Grass-type), Crush Club (Fighting-type & lowers Def, handles Ice weakness)
Though, even then they'd probably want to give all of them cutesy names and some words only has so many synonyms. Yeah, probably for the best it was Pikachu and Eevee.
Replaying Sun and Moon raises some questions;
1) How does Lillie using Repel even work? Repels work by preventing the Pokemon lower levelled than your lead to spawn. She has no Pokemon except Nebby.
2) If Lillie is so worried about Nebby getting out of her bag, why does she not keep it in a Pokeball or ask the Player to do so for her?
3) Why do you not get "Seen" for Rotom and any of the Poke Ride Pokemon automatically the first time you see them?
1) How does Lillie using Repel even work? Repels work by preventing the Pokemon lower levelled than your lead to spawn. She has no Pokemon except Nebby.
2) If Lillie is so worried about Nebby getting out of her bag, why does she not keep it in a Pokeball or ask the Player to do so for her?
3) Why do you not get "Seen" for Rotom and any of the Poke Ride Pokemon automatically the first time you see them?
for 1: Keep in mind we only see Nebby's level once, when we catch them. Considering it's a higher level than wild mons then, it's not unreasonable to assume it's been at a high enough level throughout.
for 2: It's possible she's worried about her ball/PC being hacked. We know from XY that methods for hacking balls exist, and Aether is also known to be good at manipulating pokeball tech. Given Lusamine's desire for control over her children, knowing their PC passwords wouldn't come as a surprise. However, not giving responsibility to the player character seems mostly there so you can't break the story by keeping Nebby safe and/or unevolved.
for 3: It's possible that the mons in their ride gear/rotomdex would count as separate forms from normal, and that the dex doesn't recognize those forms.
I just find making this kind of theory more interesting than actually following a plot.
for 2: It's possible she's worried about her ball/PC being hacked. We know from XY that methods for hacking balls exist, and Aether is also known to be good at manipulating pokeball tech. Given Lusamine's desire for control over her children, knowing their PC passwords wouldn't come as a surprise. However, not giving responsibility to the player character seems mostly there so you can't break the story by keeping Nebby safe and/or unevolved.
for 3: It's possible that the mons in their ride gear/rotomdex would count as separate forms from normal, and that the dex doesn't recognize those forms.
I just find making this kind of theory more interesting than actually following a plot.
Save for OR/AS with the DexNav.
1) Ironmage is on point here. We get it at Level 55 so it was at very least at Level 53 when it was with Lillie (and since Cosmog and Cosmoem doesn't know any attacking moves it's not like Lille could use it in battle even if she wanted to).
2) I just think Lillie is really inexperienced and possibly didn't think of putting it in a Poke Ball. Or she tried to in the past but 1) due to how demure Lillie is she asked Cosmog and it refused or 2) it kept breaking out (and possibly got upset Lillie tried). Eitherway Lillie probably wouldn't try again.
Another factor could be that, in case of an emergency, Cosmog could Teleport them which it can't do inside a Poke Ball. Infact if Lusamine went the direct route and had a group of Aether Foundation members jump her she could in theory have Cosmog run away/hide/find someone she trusts it with even if she gets taken away. Pretty much why Team Skull needed to setup that trap for force Lillie (and Cosmog) to willingly go with them by tricking the player away and having Plumeria threaten harm on Hau and those kids in the Aether Base.
For Rotom it's because it's not native to the Alola region and there's no National Dex so no point in recording itself (this also can probably apply to the Ride Pokemon also not native to Alola). Also Rotom Dex seems to not even consider itself a Pokemon anymore but rather the object it has possessed (which is an interesting insight in a mind of a Rotom, does this apply to all other Rotom?).
For the Poke Ride Pokemon that are Pokemon in the Alola region... gonna have to BS here. Because, look, obliviously the Professor knows of all the Pokemon of the region they're in. But there's a difference between seeing a picture of an animal and observing the animal in the wild. What the Professor wants is the player to battle, catch, and train the Pokemon to better understand its behavior (maybe off screen ask locals about their opinion, stories, and any rumors/myths about the Pokemon). The Pokedex doesn't fill out when just seeing a Pokemon walking around as a reminder that you actually need to encounter it to see its behavior. And yes, this does go completely against how actual animal behavior studies are done where the point is to leave the animal alone and watch it do its thing from afar, but it's a kids game plus Pokemon seem intelligent enough to know there's a human around watching it.
The above excuse could also work for Cosmog, though another possibility is that Rotom Dex was told not to record any information on Cosmog as it was supposed to be a close knit secret. While Rotom Dex probably could hide the files, easiest way for someone not to accidentally discover it while looking through Rotom Dex's Pokemon entries is just not having a file on it at all.
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The award for biggest inconsistency in what counts as "seen" in the Pokedex definitely goes to Platinum's Spear Pillar cutscene. After the cutscene ends, Dialga and Palkia count as seen (presumably so the player can get the National Dex almost immediately after beating the game), but Uxie, Mesprit, and Azelf do not.
Maybe I'm making this up, but didn't FRLG have observation decks where you could spot Pokemon and they'd get added to your Pokedex? Or someone would show you a picture of a Pokemon?
Both of those existed, yes; and were notable exceptions.
Deleted User 465389
Banned deucer.
uxie can erase your memories, maybe it did that
Or before then when you saw them trapped in the Team Galactic HQ, you even were able to interact with them (or at least told what you were seeing).
Related: I'm pretty sure you have to find a book about Manaphy to add it as Seen on the Dex to get the National Dex.
Yup, but the book is only in Platinum. In Sinnoh's Pokemon Mansion (where Mr. Backlot and his Trophy Garden is) there's a book on Backlot's desk about Manaphy that'll add it to your dex. This is needed for completing the Sinnoh Dex because for some baffling reason Manaphy is part of the regional dex. For those who don't know, it's baffling because Mythical Pokemon usually aren't required to complete the dex since you may not have access to the Events. BTW, I think this does mean vanilla DP is impossible to complete the dex without trading Manaphy into it (or hacking it in).
To make things further not make sense, they excluded two normal Legendaries: Regigigas and Cresselia. Now Regigigas makes sense, you need the other Regi Trio to wake it up and if you don't have access to Gen III then you'd be stuck. However, Cresselia? They included Manaphy but not Cresselia? I noticed Cresselia is next to Manaphy on the National Dex (after Phione), was this maybe a mistake? They meant Cresselia but for some reason went two numbers up and added Manaphy by accident. Like, on one hand I could see them adding in Manaphy to advertise the Pokemon Ranger game, but for them to then leave out Cresselia feels random. Unless Cresselia was meant to be included but to advertise Pokemon Ranger they decided to swap it out for Manaphy, but that would be a pretty jerk move. And they kept it for Platinum, just gave you a way to see it without battling/capturing it, so either it was a lack of foresight or a mistake they didn't want to owe up to (though too bad they didn't make it so if you connected vanilla DP to Platinum which had the Manaphy recorded it'll also record the Manaphy onto the dex of those games, they were able to use Emerald to fix the Berry timer glitch when it connected to Ruby & Sapphire so it's something they done before).
EDIT: Well that's a shoe in my mouth (both as I linked to this post in the "Little Things That Annoy You Thread"). Requirement to see Manaphy was added in Platinum (Bulbapedia just showed Manaphy was part of the dex so since you needed to see it in Platinum I assumed the same was true for DP). Still strange Cresselia wasn't part of the regional dex and in Platinum it was Manaphy made required instead of adding Cresselia. *shrugs*
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You don't need to see Manaphy to complete the Sinnoh Dex in Diamond/Pearl; that requirement was added in Platinum along with the book where you do see it. Manaphy was Sinnoh's parallel to Mew where the Sinnoh Dex had 150 Pokémon you could normally see and then an elusive mythical 151st that you don't need to run into.
Wasn’t Nebby a wild ‘mon when she had it? Perhaps she didn’t want to catch it because... well I got nothing really.
Lillie is "not a trainer". She says it herself. Constantly. Ad nauseam.
But she did rescue Cosmog from the Aether Paradise, so... maybe she doesn't think putting it in a Poke Ball is right? Either that or it just plain refused to go in and she SOMEHOW thinks stuffing it in a duffel bag is more humane...
Though on that note... How the heck was she able to carry Cosmoem all the way to the Altar of the Sunne/Moone? It's like 2024 pounds!
With Nebby floating.
Yung Dramps
awesome gaming
In Sword and Shield, Runerigus, the new regional evolution for Galarian Yamask, requires you to travel to a specific location while Yamask's HP is depleted by 49 points or more to evolve it. What's the significance of the number 49?
Let's see what wikipedia has to say...
Hmm, well in some practices of Buddhism, 49 days is the one of the lengths of the intermediate state known as "bardo". Pretty much when you die you got to wait a certain number of days before you can be reincarnated (so even in death you can't escape waiting in a line...). Between this time the spirit is not connected to the physical body it goes through stages or spiritual clarity, terrifying hallucinations, and liberation & transcendental insight; Buddhists who believe in bardo train themselves so they can attain the liberation & transcendental insight without the terrifying hallucinations that's caused by one's passed "unskillful" actions. As for why it's 49 days, the ones which believe it's that many days do so because 49 is "7 times 7".
I have a mystery that's from the real world: I get that in Japan, Mr. Mime is known as Barrierd which is not a gender-specific name.
But surely, with how massive Pokémon became, wouldn't have GF, Nintendo or TPCi made the conscious decision to make it a male-only species when the concept was introduced in GSC due to 8 of its international names referencing the male gender, not to mention its design being that of a balding man mime?
And Mr. Mime could be seen as a counterpart to Jynx
, which herself is a female-only species. Make it make sense.
But surely, with how massive Pokémon became, wouldn't have GF, Nintendo or TPCi made the conscious decision to make it a male-only species when the concept was introduced in GSC due to 8 of its international names referencing the male gender, not to mention its design being that of a balding man mime?
And now we have Mr. Rime in Galar, which also has a gender-specific name but can also be female?
And Mr. Mime could be seen as a counterpart to Jynx
especially with the typing of Galarian Mr. Mime and Mr. Rime
It makes sense just fine. "Mr. Mime" is a name that the in-world researchers who first discovered the species gave it. Maybe they wrongly thought the species was male-only and the name stuck (and then transferred over to whichever of the two regional versions was discovered later because it had become known in the other region already). Maybe "Mr. Mime" was the name of some character in a book or something and whoever discovered the species thought it was reminiscent of the character. Etc. Never mind that the way different genders are manifested in that species may be so different that "male" and "female" don't mean what you think and "Mr." basically means nothing in the context.
So let's talk about those Sword and Shield Fossils and what they mean for the Pokedex. Spoilers ahead, obviously.
So as you may know, the fossil pokemon this time aren't true fossils but based on the mistakes of early palentologist by putting any random dinosaur bones together and calling it a creature. Thus there are 4 possible fossil pokemon for 2 heads and 2 tails:
But as you can clearly tell, going against Arceus' will is bad and each one of them is a freak of nature in some way. Dracozolt has the best situation with it's tiny arms, but Arctozolt is freezing, Arctovish's head is on backwards, and the less said about poor Dracovish the better.
So clearly these aren't true fossil pokemon but chimeras created on the spot, right? Well, then we have the Pokedex:
Dracovish
Powerful legs and jaws made it the apex predator of its time. Its own overhunting of its prey was what drove it to extinction.
Its mighty legs are capable of running at speeds exceeding 40 mph, but this Pokémon can't breathe unless it's underwater.
Arctozolt
This Pokémon lived on prehistoric seashores and was able to preserve food with the ice on its body. It went extinct because it moved so slowly.
Dracozolt
In ancient times, it was unbeatable thanks to its powerful lower body, but it went extinct anyway after it depleted all its plant-based food sources.
Arctovish
The skin on its face is impervious to attack, but breathing difficulties made this Pokémon go extinct anyway.
Most of entries seem to be just flat-out wrong (like, Dracovish and Arctovish seem to breathe fine in-game) and others are making assumptions like they're real dinosaurs even though they aren't.
Which feeds into my long standing theory that the Pokedex just isn't to be trusted. My theory is that like early paleontologists, these entries were made to fit a false hypothesis (that because they were able to create these chimeras, they must have existed in ancient times. So they made up theories on why they went extinct despite using bad evidence).
But as you can clearly tell, going against Arceus' will is bad and each one of them is a freak of nature in some way. Dracozolt has the best situation with it's tiny arms, but Arctozolt is freezing, Arctovish's head is on backwards, and the less said about poor Dracovish the better.
So clearly these aren't true fossil pokemon but chimeras created on the spot, right? Well, then we have the Pokedex:
Dracovish
Powerful legs and jaws made it the apex predator of its time. Its own overhunting of its prey was what drove it to extinction.
Its mighty legs are capable of running at speeds exceeding 40 mph, but this Pokémon can't breathe unless it's underwater.
Arctozolt
This Pokémon lived on prehistoric seashores and was able to preserve food with the ice on its body. It went extinct because it moved so slowly.
Dracozolt
In ancient times, it was unbeatable thanks to its powerful lower body, but it went extinct anyway after it depleted all its plant-based food sources.
Arctovish
The skin on its face is impervious to attack, but breathing difficulties made this Pokémon go extinct anyway.
Most of entries seem to be just flat-out wrong (like, Dracovish and Arctovish seem to breathe fine in-game) and others are making assumptions like they're real dinosaurs even though they aren't.
Which feeds into my long standing theory that the Pokedex just isn't to be trusted. My theory is that like early paleontologists, these entries were made to fit a false hypothesis (that because they were able to create these chimeras, they must have existed in ancient times. So they made up theories on why they went extinct despite using bad evidence).
Let's also take into account WHO is giving you the fossils. The scientist, Cara Liss (a pun on "careless", already a hint if her just combining two fossils together haphazardly wasn't already a red flag), if I recall, mentions how the revived Pokemon must have walked around ancient Galar a long time ago... even though she knows you just combined two fossils together.
Also she has one red show and one yellow shoe, this lady is not to be trusted as a reliable source... or ethical scientist.