NBA All-Decade Teams

[darkie]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=2997

I found this interesting article about an All-Decade team for the 2000s based on players' statistical achievements. I think it's interesting that Dirk is, according to the stats, the best player of the 2000s. These are the teams if you're too lazy to click the link:

First Team:
Kobe
Chauncey
Dirk
Tim
Shaq

Second Team:
Stevo
Ray
KG
LeBron
Ben Wallace

Third Team:
Tracy McGrady
Jason Kidd
Shawn Marion
Paul Pierce
Amare

Discuss and maybe make your own All-Decade teams.

 

[Mr.Pizzle]

Shit I had to come back and post for this no matter what. The teams here that I make are just who I think are the best at their position for the 2000's.

1st Team:
PG: Jason Kidd
SG: Kobe Bryant(really, cant argue here)
SF: Lebron James
PF Tim Duncan
C: Shaq Oneal

2nd Team:
PG: Steve Nash
SG: Dwane Wade
SF: Kevin Garnett(I cant knock him past second team..)
PF: Dirk Nowitzki
C: Dwight Howard

3rd Team:
PG: Chauncey Billups
SG: Allen Iverson(he was nice for sure)
SF: Paul Pierce
PF: Amare Stoudamire
C: Yao Ming

Im SURE im missing someone.

 

[darkie]

I'd rather put Dirk at SF than KG lol.

 

[Lakers]

Shit I had to come back and post for this no matter what. The teams here that I make are just who I think are the best at their position for the 2000's.

1st Team:
PG: Jason Kidd
SG: Kobe Bryant(really, cant argue here)
SF: Lebron James
PF Tim Duncan
C: Shaq Oneal

2nd Team:
PG: Steve Nash
SG: Dwane Wade
SF: Kevin Garnett(I cant knock him past second team..)
PF: Dirk Nowitzki
C: Dwight Howard

3rd Team:
PG: Chauncey Billups
SG: Allen Iverson(he was nice for sure)
SF: Paul Pierce
PF: Amare Stoudamire
C: Yao Ming

Im SURE im missing someone.

The only reason I wouldnt put Lebron in the first team is because he hasnt been playing in the whole decade. Id have to put Garnett over him just because of the impact Garnett had on the Celtics. Without him in the lineup you can just see how different they are just as a team. Lebron will have his time, but hes gotta win a ring first.

@ Darkies post: I know your hyped that Nowtizki is the leading % wise by that system, but there is one thing that seperates Dirk from everybody on that first team: Hes the only one without at least 1 ring =/

 

[Mr.Pizzle]

I can see you point OG, who would replace LBJ there in your opinion(serious Q). I might even throw Reggie Miller in there too.

If anything id swap Yao and Dwight in that list, just based upon what Yao has done for Basketball over seas and such. For some reason, I think I should have had Gasol in there some where, as well as swap Wade and AI, but meh.

 

[Brawley]

PG: Allen Iverson
SG: Kobe Braynt
SF: Lebron James
PF: Dirk Nowitzki
C: Shaq

 

[Lakers]

I can see you point OG, who would replace LBJ there in your opinion(serious Q). I might even throw Reggie Miller in there too.

If anything id swap Yao and Dwight in that list, just based upon what Yao has done for Basketball over seas and such. For some reason, I think I should have had Gasol in there some where, as well as swap Wade and AI, but meh.

I probably would slide Nowitzki to the 3 and put KG in there. Although, I might even slide Pierce in there at the 3. Its kind of unfair, but id lean more toward putting people on that have at least won a ring. Lebron would be the exception, but he only started in the 03-04 season.

 

[Dubulous]

I'm surprised actually that Ben Wallace made that list, considering that he was really a dominant player from 2000-04 and even then he wasn't any good offensively. Rarely is defense lauded in the NBA, which is certainly understandable due to the wide variety of offensive stats available versus the bare-bones defensive stats. I think that Gasol should replace Big Ben on that list.

Also, Shawn Marion are you kidding me? At his peak, Peja Stojakovich was five times the player Marion is. Shawn Marion on that list is an absolute joke.

 

[zorbees]

I think Kobe, Duncan, and Shaq are locks at their respective positions. Point Guard I would go with Nash, he was unbelievable in that stretch when he got 2 MVPs and a second to Nowitzki. Chauncey is good too, has a ring and a finals MVP, but playing on a defensive, balanced team always held his individual accolades back. At Small Forward, I would go with Garnett if he qualifies (he should if Dirk does, they basically play the same position.) He always lacked support in Minnesota yet still had some decent years there, and we all know how big he's been in Boston. I know Dirk has the numbers, but Garnett's defense and ring put him over the top for me (ironically, the same could be said for Chauncey over Nash, but I really feel that Nash was a much better offensive player)

EDIT: Prince James hasn't played enough or done anything better to distinguish himself from the pack. He won an MVP, so did Garnett and Dirk. He's made the Finals, so have Garnett (with a ring) and Dirk. I mean it's an overall decade team, and I feel Garnett's extra few years is of more value than LeBron's slighlty better performance in the last couple years.

Tl;dr:
PG: Steve Nash
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Kevin Garnett
PF: Tim Duncan
C: Shaquille O'Neal

 

[Lakers]

I'm surprised actually that Ben Wallace made that list, considering that he was really a dominant player from 2000-04 and even then he wasn't any good offensively. Rarely is defense lauded in the NBA, which is certainly understandable due to the wide variety of offensive stats available versus the bare-bones defensive stats. I think that Gasol should replace Big Ben on that list.

Also, Shawn Marion are you kidding me? At his peak, Peja Stojakovich was five times the player Marion is. Shawn Marion on that list is an absolute joke.

you also have to read that article. They also calculate playoff win %, things like that. Marion was very good when the Suns were in their prime, and they were pretty good in the playoffs as well. Peja shouldve won MVP the season after Webber blew out his knee in the playoffs against the Mavs, but he probably wasnt as effective in the point system as Marion was.

 

[Dubulous]

you also have to read that article. They also calculate playoff win %, things like that. Marion was very good when the Suns were in their prime, and they were pretty good in the playoffs as well. Peja shouldve won MVP the season after Webber blew out his knee in the playoffs against the Mavs, but he probably wasnt as effective in the point system as Marion was.

Right, that was my main point. I did read the article, and I was trying to point out some of the flaws of the system. Marion rode on the coat tails of Nash and Amare in Phoenix in their D'Antoni years, while Peja essentially carried that Sacramento team by himself. Win percentage, while it should be a factor, shouldn't have played as huge a role so that an obviously better player was left off the team.

Don't get me wrong, Marion was very good with Phoenix, but he was more of a complimentary player more than anything else. Teams didn't gameplan around stopping Marion from getting the ball. You can bet the farm, however, that opposing teams tried to stop Peja from getting open beyond the arc in Sacramento.

 

[y2zipper]

I think I would leave it the way the article has it, although based on the ratings LeBron would get on the first team because he finished better than Billups or Nash if you really don't consider positions.

It's interesting that Dirk is the greatest player of the decade based on this ratings, but if you think about it, it makes a lot of sense because his team wins 50 games plus per year and he hasn't really had the talent around him or the coaching that Kobe or Duncan has had the last ten years. Think about this: in the last 10 years, Popovich and Phil Jackson have won the championship 7 times. Phil Jackson has 4, Popovich has 3, and Pat Riley, Doc Rivers and Larry Brown each have 1. Dirk has been coached by Don Nelson and then Avery Johnson. Dirk doesn't have players like Parker, Ginobli, Shaq, or other greats that take away win shares and it comes as no surprise that he'd be the highest rated player in that category.

Edit: Oh yeah, and I'd also like to see some more eligibility requirements when it comes to position, but I understand why it is the way it is. The 3 has become a terrible position and the 5 would be too if we didn't have Shaq this decade. All the talent has moved to PG, SG, and PF.

You can argue that Garnett hasn't either, but Maybe Dallas is a testament to how much better Dirk makes his teammates. We figured that out with Chauncey Billups last year when he was traded and made Denver that much better, and maybe we just haven't figured it out with Dirk yet.

 

[Lakers]

Right, that was my main point. I did read the article, and I was trying to point out some of the flaws of the system. Marion rode on the coat tails of Nash and Amare in Phoenix in their D'Antoni years, while Peja essentially carried that Sacramento team by himself. Win percentage, while it should be a factor, shouldn't have played as huge a role so that an obviously better player was left off the team.

Don't get me wrong, Marion was very good with Phoenix, but he was more of a complimentary player more than anything else. Teams didn't gameplan around stopping Marion from getting the ball. You can bet the farm, however, that opposing teams tried to stop Peja from getting open beyond the arc in Sacramento.

Well yeh, thats why somebody like Ben Wallace is so high % wise. He was great defensively on those Piston teams, but he didnt do anything on the offensive end. Im almost positive his career high for points in a game is something below 20. He was just good for defense and boards. Peja did carry that Sacramento team after Webber went down. He averaged something like 23 ppg which was crazy. Although the Kings werent as good in the playoffs which probably messed up his %

 

[Aeroblacktyl]

um...what?

dirk had nash and finley for like the first 3-4 years of the 2000's, when finley actually made an allstar team. nash was still making them AS too, so that's 2 allstars. then in 2004 cuban went and got jamison AND walker, both allstars at the time too to joni them. after that failed apart, they were all traded for jason terry, the pick that led to devin harris, and swooped up josh howard in the draft. dirk ALWAYS has talent around him, that's why mavs always get 50+ wins.

and ps, marion was averaging 20-10 before nash got there.

also, peja's team were extremely well balanced. even when webber went down, they had roughly SIX people averaging double figures. even bobby jackson and scott pollard were averaging 10+ off the bench. you still had all star BRAD MILLER in his prime on the team, giving a solid 16-9-3 and vlade was still getting his 13 a game. peja just happened to be the main weapon on a team who's offense was centered around big men passing it all over the place. and let's not forget they had MIKE BIBBY who was clutch as hell and the guy with the ball at the end of the game, not peja

 

[Dubulous]

um...what?

dirk had nash and finley for like the first 3-4 years of the 2000's, when finley actually made an allstar team. nash was still making them AS too, so that's 2 allstars. then in 2004 cuban went and got jamison AND walker, both allstars at the time too to joni them. after that failed apart, they were all traded for jason terry, the pick that led to devin harris, and swooped up josh howard in the draft. dirk ALWAYS has talent around him, that's why mavs always get 50+ wins.

and ps, marion was averaging 20-10 before nash got there.

also, peja's team were extremely well balanced. even when webber went down, they had roughly SIX people averaging double figures. even bobby jackson and scott pollard were averaging 10+ off the bench. you still had all star BRAD MILLER in his prime on the team, giving a solid 16-9-3 and vlade was still getting his 13 a game. peja just happened to be the main weapon on a team who's offense was centered around big men passing it all over the place. and let's not forget they had MIKE BIBBY who was clutch as hell and the guy with the ball at the end of the game, not peja

Marion has averaged 20-10 exactly once in his career, 05-06. Nash was busy winning an MVP award that year in Phoenix I believe.

Dirk may have always had talent around him, but Dirk has always been the best player on his teams (bar maybe Nash, but it is close).

How can you penalize Peja for being the main weapon? I thought that was the point. In Sacramento it was always Peja or Webber first, rest of team second. What made Sacramento so good was how Peja knew when to shoot it and when to pass it off, which led to Peja's absurdly high shooting percentage and his teammates point averages.

Don't get me wrong, Marion is a great player. I just think Peja was better in the decade.

 

[Lakers]

Marion has averaged 20-10 exactly once in his career, 05-06. Nash was busy winning an MVP award that year in Phoenix I believe.

Dirk may have always had talent around him, but Dirk has always been the best player on his teams (bar maybe Nash, but it is close).

How can you penalize Peja for being the main weapon? I thought that was the point. In Sacramento it was always Peja or Webber first, rest of team second. What made Sacramento so good was how Peja knew when to shoot it and when to pass it off, which led to Peja's absurdly high shooting percentage and his teammates point averages.

Don't get me wrong, Marion is a great player. I just think Peja was better in the decade.

Nobody is arguing that Dirk wasnt the best player on all those Mavs teams. The point is he hasnt won anything in Dallas. All those 50+ win seasons, and hes only been to the championship once (only to blow a 2-0 series lead). Hes had the talent around him, but he is not clutch when it matters. Plus, it doesnt help that he lead his team to the #1 seed in the west only to drop to the 8th seeded Warriors in the first round. It wasnt the best matchup for the Mavs, but that isnt an excuse. They won 67+ games that year, and were almost a lock to win the west. If you watched part of that series, Dirk was only clutch when they were down and needed to come back. When they were in a tight game, Dirk dissapeared. Warriors just took advantage of that and wrecked them in game 6 to close it out.

 

[Aeroblacktyl]

in the 3 years before nash came there marion was averaging 19.1-9.9, 21.2-9.5, 19.0-9.3, which are all pretty much 20-10 if not 'technically so'

and once again, at the end of the game, MIKE BIBBY HAS THE BALL. and in the playoffs has proven that he was the clutch one, not peja.

and didn't dirk end up down 3 on the road to spurs in game 7 in the year they made finals and actually prevailed?

also peja was only good for the first 5 years of this decade befoer he completely broke down

 

[Lakers]

in the 3 years before nash came there marion was averaging 19.1-9.9, 21.2-9.5, 19.0-9.3, which are all pretty much 20-10 if not 'technically so'

and once again, at the end of the game, MIKE BIBBY HAS THE BALL. and in the playoffs has proven that he was the clutch one, not peja.

and didn't dirk end up down 3 on the road to spurs in game 7 in the year they made finals and actually prevailed?

also peja was only good for the first 5 years of this decade befoer he completely broke down

You do remember that the Mavs were up 3-0 in that series right? Note: No team has ever come back down 3-0 in a series in the NBA, and the Spurs pushed the Mavs to game 7. It doesnt matter if Dirk pushed them past the Spurs to make the Finals. Not only did he choke in the Finals, but he would of had to carry two, if not three terrible upsets (losing as the #1 seed to the 8th seed, blowing a 2-0 lead in the finals, and if it had happened blowing a 3-0 lead to the Spurs). He isnt clutch, and its easy to spot if you watch some of his games

 

[Dubulous]

You do remember that the Mavs were up 3-0 in that series right? Note: No team has ever come back down 3-0 in a series in the NBA, and the Spurs pushed the Mavs to game 7. It doesnt matter if Dirk pushed them past the Spurs to make the Finals. Not only did he choke in the Finals, but he would of had to carry two, if not three terrible upsets (losing as the #1 seed to the 8th seed, blowing a 2-0 lead in the finals, and if it had happened blowing a 3-0 lead to the Spurs). He isnt clutch, and its easy to spot if you watch some of his games

Seems like Dirk always manages to kill the Sixers with a last minute shot against three defenders or something like that...

He does seem to disappear in the playoffs, but I wouldn't put it all on Dirk. I think that some of it has to do with coaching, because let's face it Avery Johnson wasn't/isn't a very good coach.

As far as the Peja/Marion debate, it would make sense that Mike Bibby would have the ball at the end of the game. After all, he is the point guard, it's kind of his job to handle the ball. Plus, at the end of the game I want my slasher/playmaker to handle the ball, neither of which Peja particularly excels at. But you'd have to imagine that if Peja got open (which never happened because he was such a huge threat) Bibby would get him the ball. Marion has a tendency to disappear in close games, as he largely depended on Nash/Amare to get the job done.

 

[Aeroblacktyl]

uh do you guys actually look up stuff before posting? mavs were only up 3-1, they gave up the next 2 games by 1 and 5 points before closing out.......

while it is mavs fault that they f'd up against the heat, wade did get every favorable call in those last 4 games that should have definitely been mavs. phantom call at the end of game 3 and 4 for example

 

[Mr.Pizzle]

I wouldnt say Peja has that great of an edge. Marion can play D, Peja can create a shot for himself. Though when they were in there primes id definitely try to keep both covered.

On the Mavs: The NBA didnt want them to win, thats how it works I guess. No way Dirk gets a call over Wade (as well as... Antoine Walker and washed up GP sadly).