VGC Offense or Stall... Why Not Both?

[WilliXL]

OK, I realize that true stall does NOT work in the VGC format. However, I've tried to make this team capable of dealing out damage but also able to tank and stall out opponents.

That sounds weird, I'm sure. However, bear with me. I'll try to explain my reasoning and you can judge for yourself whether I'm crazy or not...


Team at a glance:

Teambuilding Process

Going into the teambuilding, I knew I wanted two Megas. One that could deal a lot of damage and one that could tank and sort of stall. My stalling Mega I knew for sure was going to be Mega Venusaur. This thing is a monster when it comes to stalling.

So the next Mega to choose was the offensive Mega. I played around with Mega Lucario for a while, but found it to be too frail.

Then I tried Mega Salamence, but it was being countered really hard by all of the experienced players. I mean, everybody carried around a perfectly EV'd Suicune or Sylveon. So playing around that got kind of annoying.

Thus, I ended up with Mega Metagross who has amazing bulk and decently awesome Attack.

Next up is a utility Pokemon: Talonflame. Usually it's meant as a Brave Bird nuker, but on my team it mostly provides Tailwind and Will-O support. Occasionally it is useful against Ferrothorns (which my team hates) and provides much needed priority for this team.

Next up is Landorus-T. Fire Types, especially Heatran, are a big problem to this team. There's no real way, with the members so far, to hit them hard. Landorus-T takes care of that nicely.

Continuing with the Genies, since these Genies are just so OP, is Thundurus. In general, Spore is a very annoying move, and when I need Mega Metagross out, usually because of a Sylveon and Mega Salamence on the opposing team, it really helps to have a Prankster user on my side.

Lastly is a bit of a niche Pokemon. I may or may not have taken this set from Angel Miranda (sorry, I'm not creative enough to think of such cool niche Pokemon). Heatwave and Earthquake are pretty big problems to this team (mostly to Mega Metagross), and Swampert shuts those down completely. Also, it can hit pretty hard.

Replays

Mega Metagross Cutting It Close
Smooth Stalling

So that's how the team was built. Given just the team composition, I still might sound a little bit crazy, but just bear with me here.
Let's take a look at each individual Pokemon.

Here's the formatting I will use:

Nickname (Pokemon) @ Item - Explanation
Ability - Explanation
EVs
Nature - Explanation
Moves - Explanation

Summary
Defensive Calcs
Offensive Calcs
Threats

420 (Venusaur) @ Venusaurite - For that Mega
Ability: Chlorophyll - Just in case I'm facing a Char Y
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 76 SpA / 52 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold Nature - Many of the strong attackers are Physical, so this allows Mega Venusaur to survive pretty much everything
IVs: 0 Atk - For Foul Play
- Giga Drain - Awesome STAB attack and for longevity
- Sludge Bomb - Another good STAB attack that's reliable
- Leech Seed - This is the main stalling portion, very deadly
- Protect - Obligatory Protect, mostly to avoid predicted Will-O-Wisps

Mega Venusaur does a very good job whittling down the opposing Pokemon. It's role is to survive everything and Leech Seed everything. Also, Mega Venusaur is strong enough to do some additional damage with its two coverage moves. Overall, amazing "whittling" Pokemon.
From the Offensive Calcs you can see that Mega Venusaur can't really kill anything but really fragile Pokemon. However, the plethora of things it can survive allow for Leech Seed to really take its toll.

Defensive Calcs

252 Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 156-186 (83.4 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 170-204 (90.9 - 109%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (63 BP) vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 123-145 (65.7 - 77.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 150-176 (80.2 - 94.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Return vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 170-204 (90.9 - 109%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Aerilate Mega Salamence Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 52 SpD Mega Venusaur: 156-186 (83.4 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 126-150 (67.3 - 80.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
244+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Overheat vs. 252 HP / 52 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur in Sun: 174-206 (93 - 110.1%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 52 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 110-132 (58.8 - 70.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Offensive Calcs

76 SpA Mega Venusaur Sludge Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gardevoir: 102-120 (70.8 - 83.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
76 SpA Mega Venusaur Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Swampert: 204-240 (98.5 - 115.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
76 SpA Mega Venusaur Sludge Bomb vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Sylveon: 104-126 (51.7 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Threats

Ewww (Metagross) @ Metagrossite - For that Mega
Ability: Clear Body - Intimidate is a real pain
Shiny: Yes - Obviously
EVs: 252 HP / 28 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 180 Spe
EVs: 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe Jolly Nature
or
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe Jolly Nature - DaAwesomeDude1 suggestion because Mega-Metagross really doesn't need too much Bulk investment
Adamant Nature - More power
- Ice Punch - For longevity
- Iron Head - STAB
- Zen Headbutt - STAB
- Protect - Obligatory Protect, mostly, again, to block predicted Will-O-Wisps

This is the Offensive Mega of the team. More bulky offense than straight offensive however. Mega Metagross works well against Mega Gardevoir teams and also any team with Flying Types like pesky Mega Salamences.
Right now I'm debating between Bullet Punch and Iron Head. I'm not an extremely speedy Metagross, though I do potentially have Tailwind for Speed Control. Probably Iron Head for now though.

Defensive Calcs

252 SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Mega Metagross: 151-182 (80.7 - 97.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Mega Salamence Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Mega Metagross: 116-138 (62 - 73.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Mega Metagross: 150-176 (80.2 - 94.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Metagross: 96-114 (51.3 - 60.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Metagross: 102-122 (54.5 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Offensive Calcs

28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Salamence: 188-224 (109.9 - 130.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 180 Def Amoonguss: 198-234 (89.5 - 105.8%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Hydreigon: 128-152 (76.1 - 90.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Iron Head vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 204-240 (122.1 - 143.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Breloom: 140-166 (102.9 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Zen Headbutt vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 222-264 (163.2 - 194.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Iron Head vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 93-109 (51.3 - 60.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
-1 28+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 172-204 (104.2 - 123.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Threats

Buffalo (Talonflame) @ Sky Plate - More Brave Bird nuking potential
Ability: Gale Wings - For that priority
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature - More power, don't need too much speed
- Tailwind - Speed Control
- Flare Blitz - Mostly for pesky Ferrothorns
- Brave Bird - Mostly for opposing Mega Venusaurs, the extremely Physically bulky kind that Mega Metagross has a hard time with
- Will-O-Wisp - Pretty much the only status on my team besides Scald

Talonflame is mostly on this team for Speed Control reasons. However, in specific niche times, it can act as a pretty effective nuke to a lot of Steel/Grass types that resist both of my Megas. Also, it can pull of speedy Will-O-Wisps to help with the two Mega's bulk even more.

Defensive Calcs

Lol, who are we kidding? Talonflame can't take hits.

Offensive Calcs

252+ Atk Sky Plate Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 124+ Def Mega Venusaur: 138-164 (73.7 - 87.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 204-240 (112.7 - 132.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Metagross: 116-140 (62 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Sky Plate Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gallade: 206-246 (143 - 170.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Sky Plate Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Salamence: 79-94 (46.1 - 54.9%) -- 63.3% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Lucario: 186-218 (127.3 - 149.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Threats
Well, it doesn't really matter. Talonflame sets up Speed or Nukes (hopefully both), and then it dies (sorry, faints)

Alternative Set

Another set suggested by DaAwesomeDude1

Talonflame @ Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 164 Atk / 92 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Tailwind
- Overheat
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp / Protect

It allows Talonflame to handle some common Steel Types in VGC without sacrificing too much power. However it has less overall nuking potential and dies slower so it won't allow fast, safe switch-ins for other Pokemon.

DAT EURF (Landorus-Therian) @ Choice Band - For nuking purposes
Ability: Intimidate - Only ability and really helps out against the bunches of Physical Attackers in the meta
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
EVs: 164 HP / 60 Atk / 4 Def / 28 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature - Suggested by DaAwesomeDude1, this EV spread takes away power but gives Landorus a ton of extra bulk and more speed to take hits and hit things
Adamant Nature - MOAR POWER
- Rock Slide - Coverage move, very useful against all Flying Types and Fire Types
- Earthquake - STAB move for ridding Steel and Fire Types
- U-turn - Pivot to abuse Intimidate
- Superpower - Mainly for Mega Kangaskhans and Ferrothorns. It also really helps out against Hydreigons

Lando-T is more or less another nuke. It comes in and nukes the field then gets out. It's mostly for taking out Steel and Fire Types that threaten the team. It also helps against Flying Types if I have to bring Mega Venusaur and there's, say, an opposing Talonflame.

Defensive Calcs

+1 252+ Atk Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 120-142 (72.7 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 94-112 (56.9 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Offensive Calcs

252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Superpower vs. 252 HP / 84 Def Ferrothorn: 180-214 (99.4 - 118.2%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Superpower vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 244-288 (134.8 - 159.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Superpower vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Hydreigon: 266-314 (158.3 - 186.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T U-turn vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Hydreigon: 156-184 (92.8 - 109.5%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4- Def Mega Metagross: 240-284 (128.3 - 151.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Salamence: 122-144 (71.7 - 84.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Sylveon: 214-253 (106.4 - 125.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 94-112 (59.8 - 71.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Threats

All Ice Types pretty much

Maelstrom (Thundurus) @ Sitrus Berry - For longevity
Ability: Prankster - Only ability and it's awesome for Prankster Taunts
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 72 SpA / 68 SpD
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 44 SpA / 68 SpD / 28 Spe - EV Spread suggested by DaAwesomeDude1 that has less SpAtk but more speed to outspeed Bisharp which is a problem to this team
Calm Nature - More bulk
IVs: 0 Atk - For that Foul Play
- Taunt - Shuts down Spore users, mostly Scarfed Brelooms. Also helps out a lot against Trick Room teams
- Rain Dance - To stop Charizard Y and any Fire Types
- Thunderbolt - STAB
- Thunder Wave - More Speed Control! Yay!

Thundurus serves as an amazing support Pokemon. It could be used offensively, however, I really believe that it's better as a support Pokemon in the VGC format. The EVs are mostly from Cybertron, I believe. They allow Thundurus to survive most hits in the Meta. I basically bring Thundurus out against any team that seems to use a lot of set up and/or have a lot of Speed Control of their own.

Defensive Calcs

252+ SpA Heatran Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus: 91-108 (48.9 - 58%) -- 95.3% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Thundurus: 159-189 (85.4 - 101.6%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Thundurus: 130-153 (69.8 - 82.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
60 SpA Rotom-W Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus: 70-84 (37.6 - 45.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Return vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Thundurus: 70-83 (37.6 - 44.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Mega Salamence Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus: 106-126 (56.9 - 67.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Lopunny Return vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Thundurus: 70-84 (37.6 - 45.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Overheat vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus in Rain: 70-84 (37.6 - 45.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus: 156-185 (83.8 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Offensive Calcs

72 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 12 SpD Mega Charizard Y: 116-138 (75.8 - 90.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
72 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 84 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 176-210 (107.3 - 128%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Threats

Perty (Swampert) @ Expert Belt - For more power
Ability: Torrent - Scald will hurt, a lot
Level: 50
IVs: 0 Atk - Foul Play
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 228 SpA / 4 SpD / 20 Spe
- Ice Beam - Ice hits 4x against so many Pokemon
- Earth Power - STAB, mostly for Heatrans
- Scald - STAB and burn
- Wide Guard - To block Earthquakes and Heatwaves mostly, and Sylveon Hyper Voice spam

This set is from Angel. It's a really big help to the team, covering up many weaknesses that the team has while providing Wide Guard support against Earthquakes and Heatwaves.

Defensive Calcs

252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Swampert: 156-184 (75.3 - 88.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Salamence Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Swampert: 114-135 (55 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Swampert: 139-163 (67.1 - 78.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Tough Claws Mega Metagross Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Swampert: 180-216 (86.9 - 104.3%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Swampert: 165-195 (79.7 - 94.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Offensive Calcs

228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Salamence: 216-259 (126.3 - 151.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
228+ SpA Swampert Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Kangaskhan in Rain: 84-100 (46.4 - 55.2%) -- 67.6% chance to 2HKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Metagross: 139-166 (89.6 - 107%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 230-274 (125 - 148.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Earth Power vs. 56 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 288-346 (166.4 - 200%) -- guaranteed OHKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Ice Beam vs. 200 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-T: 245-288 (129.6 - 152.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 68+ SpD Thundurus: 101-120 (54.3 - 64.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
228+ SpA Expert Belt Swampert Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Mawile: 158-187 (100.6 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Threats

So that's the team. Please pick it apart as much as possible!

Importable

420 (Venusaur) @ Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 76 SpA / 52 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Leech Seed
- Protect

Ewww (Metagross) @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Protect

Buffalo (Talonflame) @ Sky Plate
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Tailwind
- Flare Blitz
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp

DAT EURF (Landorus-Therian) @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Superpower

Maelstrom (Thundurus) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 72 SpA / 68 SpD
Calm Nature
- Taunt
- Rain Dance
- Thunderbolt
- Thunder Wave

Perty (Swampert) (M) @ Expert Belt
Ability: Torrent
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 228 SpA / 4 SpD / 20 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Scald
- Wide Guard

Changes will be made in Red.

Thanks for reading!

 

[Juridisch advies]

Hi there,

Nice team! I really like that pert set and the use of a defensive minded mega + offensive minded mega.
I'm learning to play VGC so I'm not sure if I am of help to you. However, I have a suggestion for your team.
Overheat > flare blitz to take out ferros more effectively (iron bard / recoil / possible rocky helmet) You could also run quick guard, because ferros aren't that common I believe.

 

[Arcticblast]

You did all of your damage calcs at level 100; for VGC they should be done at level 50.

 

[WilliXL]

Hi there,

Nice team! I really like that pert set and the use of a defensive minded mega + offensive minded mega.
I'm learning to play VGC so I'm not sure if I am of help to you. However, I have a suggestion for your team.
Overheat > flare blitz to take out ferros more effectively (iron bard / recoil / possible rocky helmet) You could also run quick guard, because ferros aren't that common I believe.

I've considered that, though I don't want to invest any EVs into Sp Atk at all and Flare Blitz does enough damage where doubling into Ferro would work. Besides, Talonflame is meant to die quickly so that a new Pokemon can be switched in. The Talonflame is really what gets the team momentum, but it's not a necessity.
However, I'll try it out some more then tell you what I think.

You did all of your damage calcs at level 100; for VGC they should be done at level 50.

See, I thought it was weird. Back in the day, the calculator used to say what level the Pokes were at, unless the Pokes were already at level 100. I did change all the levels to 50 when I did my calcs though, so these are all valid.

That being said, will you still rate my team? :D

 

[DaAwesomeDude1]

Solid team man, there isn't much I would change except for a few EV spreads so lets get right into it! For starters, I would just use max Speed and max Attack for Metagross's EV spread. While your spread is certainly creative, it honestly does more harm than good. 180 Speed Adamant Mega Metagross hits a speed stat of 153 which is outsped by Timid max Speed Hydreigon, not to mention Ice Punch isn't even an OHKO. By going max Speed max Attack, you are able to outrun Terrakion and Hydreigon while also being able to OHKO standard Amoonguss, which is something that 28 Attack Adamant Mega Metagross can't do. I actually had a lot of time on my hands so I did a rough version of the current spread you had which is 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe with a Jolly nature. This allows Mega Metagross to outspeed Timid max Speed Hydreigon while also surviving and KOing everything you had listed, except there's now a 18.8% chance that Dark Pulse from Timid LO Hydreigon OHKOs but that's a risk I would be willing to take. It also has a lowered chance of OHKOing Amoonguss so I'll leave it to you for which one you want.

Another spread I would chance is Landorus's. Choice Band Landorus has so much potential for a custom spread since it doesn't necessarily have to run max Attack for power. So I suggest changing Landorus's EV spread to MajorBowman's spread of 164 HP / 60 Atk / 4 Def / 28 SpD / 252 Spe with a Jolly Nature. This allows Landorus to outrun neutral Base 101s and below while also surviving a +1 LO Sucker Punch from Bisharp and Hidden Power Ice from neutral Zapdos and Thundurus.

Offensive Calcs

60 Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Superpower vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 194-230 (107.1 - 127%) -- guaranteed OHKO
60 Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 200-236 (119.7 - 141.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Defensive Calcs

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 164 HP / 4 Def Landorus-T: 153-183 (82.7 - 98.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Thundurus Hidden Power Ice vs. 164 HP / 28 SpD Landorus-T: 156-184 (84.3 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

As for Thundurus, I would definitely go with 252 HP / 116 Def / 44 SpA / 68 SpD / 28 Spe with a Calm nature. It's essentially the same spread but with more Speed. Bisharp is kind of a problem for your team, with this spread, it allows Thundurus to outspeed it so you can hit it with a Thunderbolt. It also gets the same KOs that your previous spread had too, so you're not losing much. Rain Dance is a pretty cool option for it!

Calcs

44 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 174-206 (112.9 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
44 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Charizard Y: 114-134 (74.5 - 87.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

All in all, VERY good team! I'm probably going to test this team out a bit too haha. Hope I helped man and good luck with the team!!! :]
-DaAwesomeDude1

Sets

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe (or Max/Max, that's up to you)
Jolly Nature
- Ice Punch
- Iron Head
- Zen Headbutt
- Protect

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 164 HP / 60 Atk / 4 Def / 28 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
– Earthquake
– Superpower
– U-turn
– Rock Slide

Thundurus @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 44 SpA / 68 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Rain Dance
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt

 

[WilliXL]

Solid team man, there isn't much I would change except for a few EV spreads so lets get right into it! For starters, I would just use max Speed and max Attack for Metagross's EV spread. While your spread is certainly creative, it honestly does more harm than good. 180 Speed Adamant Mega Metagross hits a speed stat of 153 which is outsped by Timid max Speed Hydreigon, not to mention Ice Punch isn't even an OHKO. By going max Speed max Attack, you are able to outrun Terrakion and Hydreigon while also being able to OHKO standard Amoonguss, which is something that 28 Attack Adamant Mega Metagross can't do. I actually had a lot of time on my hands so I did a rough version of the current spread you had which is 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe with a Jolly nature. This allows Mega Metagross to outspeed Timid max Speed Hydreigon while also surviving and KOing everything you had listed, except there's now a 18.8% chance that Dark Pulse from Timid LO Hydreigon OHKOs but that's a risk I would be willing to take. It also has a lowered chance of OHKOing Amoonguss so I'll leave it to you for which one you want.

Another spread I would chance is Landorus's. Choice Band Landorus has so much potential for a custom spread since it doesn't necessarily have to run max Attack for power. So I suggest changing Landorus's EV spread to MajorBowman's spread of 164 HP / 60 Atk / 4 Def / 28 SpD / 252 Spe with a Jolly Nature. This allows Landorus to outrun neutral Base 101s and below while also surviving a +1 LO Sucker Punch from Bisharp and Hidden Power Ice from neutral Zapdos and Thundurus.

Offensive Calcs

60 Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Superpower vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 194-230 (107.1 - 127%) -- guaranteed OHKO
60 Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 200-236 (119.7 - 141.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Defensive Calcs

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 164 HP / 4 Def Landorus-T: 153-183 (82.7 - 98.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Thundurus Hidden Power Ice vs. 164 HP / 28 SpD Landorus-T: 156-184 (84.3 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

As for Thundurus, I would definitely go with 252 HP / 116 Def / 44 SpA / 68 SpD / 28 Spe with a Calm nature. It's essentially the same spread but with more Speed. Bisharp is kind of a problem for your team, with this spread, it allows Thundurus to outspeed it so you can hit it with a Thunderbolt. It also gets the same KOs that your previous spread had too, so you're not losing much. Rain Dance is a pretty cool option for it!

Calcs

44 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 174-206 (112.9 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
44 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Charizard Y: 114-134 (74.5 - 87.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

All in all, VERY good team! I'm probably going to test this team out a bit too haha. Hope I helped man and good luck with the team!!! :]
-DaAwesomeDude1

Sets

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 180 HP / 116 Atk / 4 Def / 44 SpD / 164 Spe (or Max/Max, that's up to you)
Jolly Nature
- Ice Punch
- Iron Head
- Zen Headbutt
- Protect

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 164 HP / 60 Atk / 4 Def / 28 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
– Earthquake
– Superpower
– U-turn
– Rock Slide

Thundurus @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 44 SpA / 68 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Rain Dance
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt

Wow! Thanks so much for all of these calcs! Most of these sets are re-used from past teams so they served different purposes for the Mega they were supporting, but yeah, these EVs are so much better than the ones I had before.

I really like the Mega-Gross and Thundurus ones you provided. (I had actually already changed Lando's to something similar, with more bulk just didn't get time to change the RMT).

For Mega Gross, looking back through the Calcs again, I realized that I used to run a more defensive offense team with just Mega-Gross. But with Mega Venusuaur as its partner, Mega Gross really doesn't need any investment in its bulk. So I think running the Max/Max would be the best idea. Sorry I'm not using the spread that you had meticulously calced. Because, the Max/Max will survive a max attack double-edge from Mega-Mence after a DD, after even 2 DDs. So I think I'm going to with Max/Max.

But yeah, thanks so much for these EV spreads. I will continue looking at the Mega-Gross spread and seeing if anything can be tweaked, and also the Lando one seeing if any of the defenses need tweaking, but overall I just want to really thank you so much for these spreads. They are working out very well so far.

 

[Steven Stone]

Amazing team the one you got here (i've been working on a similar idea). Now, even when it's kinda a weird decision, i'd definitely follow Juridisch advies reccomendation and put Overheat on that Talonflame
Reason not being Ferrothorn, but rather, Aegislash. Aegislash is one of the biggest Mega Metagross' check (i could even get far enough to call it a counter) and Flare Blitz as fire STAB is not the best choice most of the time, as Talonflame is going to hit mainly Steel Types with it, and the extra recoil is sometimes not worth it. If you are actually willing to do that change, give it a Life Orb as Overheat without it is pretty weak.
Tagging DaAwesomeDude1 'cause he is bae af. (Nah, is because he must have a better mixed Talonflame EV spread than the one i got and i wanna hear what the man got to say).

 

[DaAwesomeDude1]

Honestly I don't think Overheat is the best move for his team. Considering it needs the Life Orb to pick up KOs against common Steel-types like Mega Meta and Aegislash (and if you don't use LO, you have to invest heavily into SpA which will lead to weakened Brave Birds). It's really only good against Ferrothorn, and at that point I'd rather just Flare Blitz it. But if you really want to use Overheat I would use 164 Atk / 92 SpA / 252 Spe with a Naughty nature and switch the item to Life Orb. This spread picks up an OHKO against 4 HP Mega Meta while still allowing Brave Bird to have a chance of OHKOing Amoonguss. I would personally stick with what you already have though.

Sets

This is only IF you want to use it

Talonflame @ Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 164 Atk / 92 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Tailwind
- Overheat
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp / Protect

 

[WilliXL]

Honestly I don't think Overheat is the best move for his team. Considering it needs the Life Orb to pick up KOs against common Steel-types like Mega Meta and Aegislash (and if you don't use LO, you have to invest heavily into SpA which will lead to weakened Brave Birds). It's really only good against Ferrothorn, and at that point I'd rather just Flare Blitz it. But if you really want to use Overheat I would use 164 Atk / 92 SpA / 252 Spe with a Naughty nature and switch the item to Life Orb. This spread picks up an OHKO against 4 HP Mega Meta while still allowing Brave Bird to have a chance of OHKOing Amoonguss. I would personally stick with what you already have though.

Sets

This is only IF you want to use it

Talonflame @ Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 164 Atk / 92 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Tailwind
- Overheat
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp / Protect

Yeah. The Mega-Gross and Mega-Venusaur combination doesn't have a really problems with Amoonguss, opposing Mega-Gross, or Aegislash really. Talonflame's main (main) role is to set up Tailwind and hopefully get an attack off then die. It's actually better to have recoil damage in a lot of situations so that I can safely bring in other Pokemon. It's rare that I ever preserve Talonflame as 5 turns of Tailwind will be plenty and none of my not-super-fast-Pokemon really need a lot of speed in order to function (like Mega Venusaur and Swampert). The rest of my team is all already really fast without Tailwind.

I'll add your set in under the current set though, it could prove to be very interesting in some situations, since I don't really have strong counters to Aegislash or Mega-Gross.