Rain dance lets you stand a chance against unaware clef, which is huge in this meta, and, as you said, let's it absorb status, which is awesome for offensive teams that have no means of getting rid of status. It's especially useful for stopping stray wisps from crippling a physical attacker. Overall, it just works really well against stall, which manaphy really loves to break. It is also able to cancel out weather changing abilities, which is neat. I think it warrants an S-rank, tbh.I guess my primary concern with TG + RD is that it's forgoing coverage for more setup. Manaphy's greatest strength without a doubt is the move Tail Glow. Using RD before TG makes sense in a few situations such as status absorption, however the power of just clicking TG right off the bat is generally preferred. RD does allow Manaphy to break past certain defensive things, but against less defensive teams it wishes it had the coverage. Basically what this set does is strengthen's Manaphy's ability to beat stall and some balance builds but hurts its ability against other balance when it's missing coverage for things like Latios or Ferrothorn. It also is a bit worse against offense (sand offense notwithstanding which I think is a good point) which doesn't rely on status and isn't usually trying to wall you anyway. Of course all this only means that I'm saying TG 3 attacks > TG RD but not that TG RD shouldn't be S. I think the reason it shouldn't be S is that the other set is what got it to this rank and I think the gap between their general effectiveness is a full subrank which frankly is quite hard to quantify.
Those really aren't accurate comparisons tho- breloom is more of a AoA set or potentially swords dance attacker that is meant to punch holes in the opponents team and stuff- chesnaught is supposed to sweep through teams, given the chance. Azu is completely different typing and reliant upon priority, and it isn't like BD sweeper is a role you look to fill for most teams- the shared role they fill is just sweeper and belly drum is the means they do so by. Saying it outclasses it as a belly drum sweeper is overly specific, but simplified at the same time. I am not phrasing this the best way possible, but basically, the two are different enough that you may as well say "scizor outclasses weavile as a swords dance sweeper." And it honestly isn't D rank. I started trying to ladder with a team built around it just a few weeks before ladder reset and made it to 1450 on a pretty much fresh alt (it may have been like, 1100). I am no master by any means, and that was playing super casually, since I knew the reset was coming up. D rank is WAY underselling it. I would honestly put it in the neighborhood of B, but I think most people disagree. Partially why it is so good is its offensive and defensive synergy with a lot of stuff, and the surprise factor when playing it. It's very easy to bluff a balance team when playing ches, so the opponent tends to play as such, only to find that the offensive pressure easily overwhelms them. I think it honestly justifies AT LEAST a C. This is based on extensive playing with it in the past, as well as somewhat more limited testing before the reset, and a decent amount since. It's not without its own flaws, but it is by no means D rank-worthy.I think Belly Drum Chesnaught should be D rank. It's outclassed both as a belly drummer (Azumarill) and a grass/fighting attacker (by Breloom). Azumarill's STABs are resisted by these pokes (and some other irrelevant ones): Ferrothorn, Venusaur, Tentacruel, Empoleon, Roserade, Amoonguss. Meanwhile, Chesnaught's STABs are resisted by TONS of stuff (there's a long list - just trust me). All in all, it's a poor belly drummer and a poor grass type attacker. Its belly drum set is much inferior to its defensive/spikes set. I think it should drop.
Even without those comparisons, Chesnaught still has to deal with the fact that its STABs are resisted by the majority of the metagame, which is a huge deal, considering BDChesnaught doesn't run any coverage.Those really aren't accurate comparisons tho- breloom is more of a AoA set or potentially swords dance attacker that is meant to punch holes in the opponents team and stuff- chesnaught is supposed to sweep through teams, given the chance. Azu is completely different typing and reliant upon priority, and it isn't like BD sweeper is a role you look to fill for most teams- the shared role they fill is just sweeper and belly drum is the means they do so by. Saying it outclasses it as a belly drum sweeper is overly specific, but simplified at the same time. I am not phrasing this the best way possible, but basically, the two are different enough that you may as well say "scizor outclasses weavile as a swords dance sweeper." And it honestly isn't D rank. I started trying to ladder with a team built around it just a few weeks before ladder reset and made it to 1450 on a pretty much fresh alt (it may have been like, 1100). I am no master by any means, and that was playing super casually, since I knew the reset was coming up. D rank is WAY underselling it. I would honestly put it in the neighborhood of B, but I think most people disagree. Partially why it is so good is its offensive and defensive synergy with a lot of stuff, and the surprise factor when playing it. It's very easy to bluff a balance team when playing ches, so the opponent tends to play as such, only to find that the offensive pressure easily overwhelms them. I think it honestly justifies AT LEAST a C. This is based on extensive playing with it in the past, as well as somewhat more limited testing before the reset, and a decent amount since. It's not without its own flaws, but it is by no means D rank-worthy.
Okay I feel the need to chime in on Chesnaught here. I'm gonna go straight to the point but...
Personally, I think it's weak after its set up (its STABs are also horrible together, with three different individual typings resisting both and without them covering one another's resists aside from steel), finds a very hard time setting up, relies overwhelmingly on the surprise factor that it's not a defensive set, and slow after it sets up. I think D is the perfect place for it. I recognize that it might fit on a team or two but in reality its niche is very limited, as well as its strength.
These arguments are actually much more valid, however they are actually both based on an incorrect assumption that is actually pretty commonplace. This is that belly drum chesnaught runs the traditional overgrow set with drain punch and seed bomb. The ideology is that this lets you ohko mega Latias at +6 with seed bomb, however, first of all, mega Latias really isn't honestly that common, and it can actually be easily ko'd with rock slide, which somehow seems to go overlooked. That lets you run bulletproof, which lets you set up on stuff like mega Venusaur w/o HP fire. It also has very good coverage with rock slide and honestly doesn't miss the power of overgrow seed bomb, since, as mentioned, grass doesn't pair well with fighting anyway, and at +6 the stab and overgrow boosts are largely unnecessary. Overgrow is still a valid option, but it just depends on the team. It is somewhat slow. That I can't argue against. However, it is fast enough to clean well against offensive teams when their faster stuff is gone, and it can easily destroy balance teams after the salac boost.Even without those comparisons, Chesnaught still has to deal with the fact that its STABs are resisted by the majority of the metagame, which is a huge deal, considering BDChesnaught doesn't run any coverage.
Meh... I mean, it's chomp, it's obviously at least decent, but it seems like kind of a waste of such a good mon to me. Chomp just has so many superior options, I'm not convinced it does deserve one, tbh.I've seen some mention of a wallbreaking Adamant LO+SD set for Garchomp. Does it merit ranking?
Which one? Because listed are the Offensive SR set (with Lum and SD), and the Sub/SD Set, which to my knowledge packs a Salac berry. Again, don't know if it's worth it, but I don't think it's covered in the existing sets.That's included in SD
Offensive SRWhich one? Because listed are the Offensive SR set (with Lum and SD), and the Sub/SD Set, which to my knowledge packs a Salac berry. Again, don't know if it's worth it, but I don't think it's covered in the existing sets.
If it's on the basis of T-waving things, Klefki and Thundy are much more reliable, especially considering they have priority thunder wave. I think sash Zam should definitely move down to B. It's really weak without the life orb, and extremely frail, even with the sash. This is in large part due to the fact that 1. offense has an absurd speed tier, and Alakazam is outsped by a lot, and 2. it's extremely weak to priority. Like AM said, it's kinda a crutch for bad teambuilding (which I know all about - my teambuilding is garbage lol). Regardless, it is vastly inferior to both Mega Alakazam and LO Alakazam, and so should be moved down.One important part of sash zam is that it gets off a pretty much guaranteed twave after it gets hit, stopping many setup sweepers and in general being a very Mexican Pokemon especially when paired with jirachi/togekiss in addition to its current power that it is knows with.