OU Pinsir

[Vague]

Mega Pinsir
QC: daddy's kisses / p2 / Finchinator
GP: P Squared
​

[OVERVIEW]

* Mega Pinsir is an extremely potent wallbreaker as well as a capable sweeper thanks to an excellent ability in Aerilate, which bestows it with an excellent Flying-type STAB move coming from base 155 Attack.
* Decent 105 base 105 Speed allows it to outpace a nice portion of the metagame.
* Its modest overall bulk eases setting up.
* It has access to relatively powerful priority in Quick Attack.
* Its dreadful typing that leaves it weak to common attacking types such as Electric, Ice, and Flying.
* It's also very weak to Stealth Rock, which can make or break how much Mega Pinsir can do for a team.
* Although it's fast enough to outpace threats such as Garchomp and Genesect, it misses out on quite a few faster ones such as Tapu Koko and Choice Scarf Tyranitar.

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Return
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Close Combat
item: Pinsirite
ability: Hyper Cutter
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Swords Dance boosts Mega Pinsir's power into ridiculous levels and allows it to tear through teams and possibly clean up late-game.
* Return is a powerful, spammable STAB attack with very few Pokemon that resist it.
* Quick Attack is an Aerilate-boosted priority move that hits surprisingly hard after Swords Dance.
* Close Combat offers excellent neutral coverage alongside Return by hitting Pokemon that resist Flying such as Rotom-W, Celesteela, and Jirachi for substantial damage.

Set Details
========

* Hyper Cutter negates Intimidate's Attack drop before Pinsir Evolves, which is helpful for setting up.
* Attack and Speed are maximized to let it hit as hard and fast as possible. Jolly is used to preserve Mega Pinsir's good Speed, notably letting it outpace threats such as Mega Charizard X, Tapu Lele, and Garchomp, but Adamant is an option to hit significantly harder.
* Adamant gives Mega Pinsir a good chance to OHKO defensive Landorus-T with a +1 Return after Stealth Rock and an increased probability of OHKOing faster threats such as Genesect and Latios with a +2 Quick Attack.

Usage Tips
========

* Mega Pinsir should usually be preserved until its checks have been sufficiently weakened to sweep.
* If faced with very unfavorable matchups, Mega Pinsir should be used as an early- to mid-game wallbreaker to pave the way for another sweeper to clean up in its wake.
* Be sure Stealth Rock is not on the field before bringing (Mega?) Pinsir into play.

Team Options
========

* Entry hazard removal is crucial, so Defog and Rapid Spin users such as Latios, Tapu Fini, and Starmie are immensely useful.
* Teammates that can deal with Electric-types such as Landorus-T, Amoonguss, and Excadrill are great partners, especially the latter, as it both sets Stealth Rock and removes them thanks to Rapid Spin.
* Magnezone is a great partner, as it easily traps then removes Skarmory and Celesteela by virtue of Magnet Pull and its Electric STAB type.
* Powerful wallbreakers that can weaken or outright eliminate Mega Pinsir's checks such as Garchomp, Landorus-T, and the aforementioned Magnezone pair very well with it, giving it better chances to sweep.
* Water-types such as Keldeo and the aforementioned Tapu Fini are great teammates, as they appreciate the pressure Mega Pinsir exerts on bulky Grass-types while they can take on threats such as Choice Scarf Tyranitar.
* Healing Wish support from Jirachi or Latias are nice partners that can give Mega Pinsir a second chance to sweep.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* Stone Edge hits Zapdos very hard, but otherwise it has no use.
* Earthquake hits Jirachi, Mega Metagross, and Chople Berry Steel-types for heavy damage.
* Substitute could be used for a better matchup against bulkier teams.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Zapdos, Rotom-W, and Tapu Koko are examples of Electric-types that can prematurely end Mega Pinsir's rampage throughby virtue of their super effective Electric-type STAB attacks. However, only Zapdos has the tools, namely reliable recovery, to deal with Mega Pinsir throughout the entire match.

**Skarmory and Celesteela**: Skarmory and Celesteela can potentially wall Mega Pinsir quite easily, as they resist it's Flying STAB. However, both must be careful, as they are 2HKOed by +2 Close Combat.

**Faster Attackers**: Faster attackers that aren't KOed by unboosted Quick Attack such as Latios, Mega Aerodactyl, Mega Metagross, Tornadus-T, Choice Scarf Magnezone, and Greninja are huge threats, as they can easily retaliate with their own strong attacks and potentially KO Mega Pinsir. Choice Scarf Tyranitar and Terrakion also outspeed and OHKO it with their STAB moves. Choice Scarf Tapu Lele deserve an honorable mention as it blocks Quick Attack and can KO Mega Pinsir with Psychic after a bit of prior damage.

**Stealth Rock**: Mega Pinsir abhors Stealth Rock, as it loses 25% or 50% of its health switching in on it in its base and Mega forme, respectively.

 

[Trinitrotoluene]

give a special mention to scarf tapu lele in the faster attackers section of c&c since it's immune to quick attack and will ohko with psychic with the help of a bit of residual damage.

 

[dk]

Hiya

[OVERVIEW]

I'd write in a bullet about how hazard removal support is absolutely imperative when using Pinsir and that Pinsir should ideally be the focal point of any team its on (in other words—Pinsir should be built around, always). Stealth Rock, imo, shouldn't just be relegated to half of a bullet point as its the cardinal concern when building with Pinsir.

Some examples of things it can outpace would be good (Landorus-I, Garchomp, etc), along with examples of things it is outsped and threatened by (Tapu Koko and Scarf Ttar).

[SET]

Looks good. No changes I would make here.

Moves
========

I would elaborate a bit on why Return is a spammable attack (few resists, basically)

Examples for what Close Combat hits would be nice within that bullet—Rotom-W, Skarmory, Celesteela, slow Tyranitar, Heatran, etc.

Remove Feint from this section and either give it a mention in Other Options or just don't mention it in the analysis at all—Talon's fall from grace kinda kills the whole point of running it.

Set Details
========

Looks good.

Usage Tips
========

I'd be more specific in how you word how Pinsir should be used in a game to break up confusion as to whether to treat it like a wallbreaker or sweeper:

Pinsir can function as either a wallbreaker or late-game sweeper depending on the matchup—should the opposition simply carry too much potential counterplay to a Pinsir sweep, it is better off used as a hole-puncher early- to mid-game. Should its potential sweeping roadblocks be relatively easy to weaken or overcome, preserving Pinsir is likely key in winning the match.

Team Options
========

I'd rework the bullet on "powerful wallbreakers" to mention more synergistic wallbreakers that help weaken Pinsir's checks (mainly Rotom-W/Skarm/Celesteela/Landorus-T). SD Garchomp/Landorus-T are good ones to mention, as not only can they weaken Pinsir checks, but they can both run Yache Berry to lure HP Ice Electrics and set Stealth Rock up. Hoopa-U and Pinsir just don't make any sense on the same team, as they're two 'mons that really must be the focal point of a build to work effectively (and they don't really have synergy together).

Other Options
=============

Looks about right. Either move the mention of Feint to this section or omit it entirely from the analysis.

Checks and Counters
===================

Change the Flying-types section specifically to Skarmory/Celesteela, and then put Mega-Aero and Torn in the Faster Attackers section. I'd also mention Scarf Magnezone and Scarf Tyranitar in the Faster Attackers section.

All in all, good work. Implement what's above and you've got your first QC check.

1/3

 

[Vague]

Implemented the above check, thanks!

 

[p2]

remove lando-i mentions

water types in team options, specifically things like keldeo appreciate pinsir being able to pressure grasses, while keldeo can switch into things like scarftar

in c&c put scarf ttar+scarf terrak in faster attackers

2/3

 

[Seamus Eso]

​

Usage Tips
========

• Mega Pinsir should usually be preserved until late-game when it's checks have been sufficiently weakened to sweep.
• If faced with very unfavorable matchups, Mega Pinsir should be used as an early to mid-game wallbreaker to pave way for another sweeper to clean up in its wake.
• Be sure Stealth Rock is not on the field before bringing Pinsir into play.

What? No. You don't preserve the 155 Atk+SD+Superb Neutral coverage until late game, you use it early and mid game to punch holes by spamming powerful attacks right of the bat or SD up and bust through phydef walls like Land-T. It's one of the very few set up sweepers that can 2HKO Unware mons. It's usage should be primarily be as an early game wall-breaker to punch holes or weaken walls like Skarmory and Gliscor for physically offensive partners such as Double Dance Land-T. Mention at the end that if your opponents faster pokemon fall to +2 Quick Attack, you can save it for late game to pull of a sweep.

 

[dk]

What? No. You don't preserve the 155 Atk+SD+Superb Neutral coverage until late game, you use it early and mid game to punch holes by spamming powerful attacks right of the bat or SD up and bust through phydef walls like Land-T. It's one of the very few set up sweepers that can 2HKO Unware mons. It's usage should be primarily be as an early game wall-breaker to punch holes or weaken walls like Skarmory and Gliscor for physically offensive partners such as Double Dance Land-T. Mention at the end that if your opponents faster pokemon fall to +2 Quick Attack, you can save it for late game to pull of a sweep.

To clarify—Pinsir isn't a wallbreaker that has the accessibility of use that things like Hoopa-U, Specs Keldeo, etc etc have. It absolutely needs rocks off the field to function even remotely similarly, which is simply not feasible to begin with given the fact that Stealth Rock is on literally every good team ever created.

Yes, Pinsir sweeps are generally going to happen more often versus fat teams, but a lot of offense is frail enough to die to +2 Aerilate QAs as well.

If you cared to read the second bullet (literally right below the one you bolded!!), it explains that Pinsir can function decently as a wallbreaker should it not present itself as a strong sweeper in that context.

The Usage Tips section is fine as-is. Ignore the user I quoted, Vague.

 

[Finchinator]

The set and overview look solid - good work.

I'd remove the mention of Double Edge if it cannot be used w/ priority as the recoil isn't welcome w/ all the RH grounds running around and priority is necessary on Mega Pinsir. I'd also give a brief mention to EQ in the OO - I know CC usually outclasses it, but it's nice for the occasional full health Heatran, Jirachi, and chople berry steel type, I suppose.

Feint doesn't deserve a mention, just to confirm the sentiment expressed in one of the prior checks (I believe you removed it, but it's piss weak now and Talon's gone+Weav's less common, so it's of little-to-no practical use)

Mention using Substitute in the OO as a lot of people used sub SD return prio move in generation six and I've seen a few people using it here and there this generation with the right support and pulling it off against fatter teams/in the right situation due to the dynamic it brings to the table and the pure strength of STAB Return, but it shouldn't get too strong of a mention as it's only used a small fraction of the time and it's certainly not something I'd simply throw onto it without a team built to support it in the right fashion.

Debating as to if there should be a brief mention of RH Grounds in the C&C because they usually switch in and fodder of to 1-2 hits while threatening it into attacking and severely damaging itself mid-late in the game, but they're honestly not actual checks/counters (bar full health RH LandoT, which is rarely the case when Pinsir comes in), so it's probably best to leave this out

3/3

 

[Vague]

daddy's kisses thanks for handling that

Added Finch's final check and this is finally ready for GP

 

[Lemonade]

modify the beginning of the overview a bit to present what kind of role Pinsir can play on your team. In this case, potent wallbreaker / sweeper probably, and maybe something unique to give readers an idea of whether Pinsir fits on their team, instead of "extremely powerful", which is sort of generic and isn't a reason to add a Pokemon to your team. Yes Aerilate is unique, but the ability itself isn't the reason to use Pinsir; rather it's the implications of it. dunno if that made sense

 

[Seamus Eso]

To clarify—Pinsir isn't a wallbreaker that has the accessibility of use that things like Hoopa-U, Specs Keldeo, etc etc have. It absolutely needs rocks off the field to function even remotely similarly, which is simply not feasible to begin with given the fact that Stealth Rock is on literally every good team ever created.

Yes, Pinsir sweeps are generally going to happen more often versus fat teams, but a lot of offense is frail enough to die to +2 Aerilate QAs as well.

If you cared to read the second bullet (literally right below the one you bolded!!), it explains that Pinsir can function decently as a wallbreaker should it not present itself as a strong sweeper in that context.

The Usage Tips section is fine as-is. Ignore the user I quoted, Vague.

So your logic is that a mon which after one SD boost OHKOs everything bar Skarmory, Zapdos and Rotom-W shouldnt be used to punch holes and break down walls but something like specs Keldeo which gets walled by everything (Amoongus, Slowbro, MVenu, Toxapex, Lati@s, AV Tang, Tapu Bulu, Tapu Fini, Mantine etc) should be used as a wall breaker? ROFL. Stealth Rocks is just one of it's issues and it absolutely needs Defog, RSpin or Lead Taunt support to function effectively. That's not a reason for not making wallbreaking it's primary function when the same applies to Zard-Y. And yeah no, nothing dies to +2 Quick Attack after Rocks except flying weaks and VERY frail mons like Latios and thats ONLY if you're Adamant.

For your information, I did read that and that's also misleading. If you had any experience using Mega Pinsir and were a decently good player, you'd know you play it two different ways. An unfavorable match vs offense is much more different from an unfavorable match up vs fat teams. Vs fat teams, you need to do the opposite of the usage tip suggests. Preserve it till you weaken or remove the mons "responsible" for the unfavorable match up such as Sand Exca, Zapdos, Skarmory, AV Torn or other Rkillers etc. These are the common stops to MPinsir on fat team and once these are weakened (Zap/Skarm in Return/CC range, Torn/Exca/Latias in QAttack range) Pinsir blows past everything else and you can sweep. In an unfavorable match up vs Offense, the cause of the "unfavorabilty" will be stuff like Koko, Thundy, Mega Meta, Rotom-W, Scarf Rachi etc in which case, your best bet is to get in Pinsir on mons that it can force out to fire of a few Returns and CCs before dying.

 

[Lemonade]

I don't think constantly keeping Rocks off and requiring +2 is very feasible, especially since a "good" opponent will keep pressure on you after they see Mega Sir. Also both sweeping and wallbreaking are mentioned in the analysis .-. Maybe it depends on playstyle or you're actually right or whatever, but importantly if you want to suggest a change you should watch your tone. I'm not the boss of you, but I'm also not the one who needs to be taken seriously here.

 

[Seamus Eso]

I saw something off and I felt I should correct that. Whether the change is implemented or not, doesn't concern me. And I will adjust my tone according to the user/manner I'm being dealt with, so I believe my manner was appropriate considering I'm responding to a post with "Ignore the user" statement. Are you saying I'm wrong to assume Smogon favors quality of content over badges/reputation of the poster about "being taken seriously"

 

[Ash Borer]

So your logic is that a mon which after one SD boost OHKOs everything bar Skarmory, Zapdos and Rotom-W shouldnt be used to punch holes and break down walls but something like specs Keldeo which gets walled by everything (Amoongus, Slowbro, MVenu, Toxapex, Lati@s, AV Tang, Tapu Bulu, Tapu Fini, Mantine etc) should be used as a wall breaker? ROFL. Stealth Rocks is just one of it's issues and it absolutely needs Defog, RSpin or Lead Taunt support to function effectively. That's not a reason for not making wallbreaking it's primary function when the same applies to Zard-Y. And yeah no, nothing dies to +2 Quick Attack after Rocks except flying weaks and VERY frail mons like Latios and thats ONLY if you're Adamant.

For your information, I did read that and that's also misleading. If you had any experience using Mega Pinsir and were a decently good player, you'd know you play it two different ways. An unfavorable match vs offense is much more different from an unfavorable match up vs fat teams. Vs fat teams, you need to do the opposite of the usage tip suggests. Preserve it till you weaken or remove the mons "responsible" for the unfavorable match up such as Sand Exca, Zapdos, Skarmory, AV Torn or other Rkillers etc. These are the common stops to MPinsir on fat team and once these are weakened (Zap/Skarm in Return/CC range, Torn/Exca/Latias in QAttack range) Pinsir blows past everything else and you can sweep. In an unfavorable match up vs Offense, the cause of the "unfavorabilty" will be stuff like Koko, Thundy, Mega Meta, Rotom-W, Scarf Rachi etc in which case, your best bet is to get in Pinsir on mons that it can force out to fire of a few Returns and CCs before dying.

You're being so antagonistic over something terribly trite. You're suggesting that Mega Pinsir be used as a wallbreaker against defensive teams. That's a good point, it definitely should and is used in such a manner, which is why there's a usage tip that denotes that. It's also a completely viable tactic to preserve mega pinsir until late game, as you also concede. In this sense, we're all in agreement in how Pinsir should be used, and yet you're trying to make fools out of people and in general acting completely arrogant and rude, only because you think the two tips should be worded a bit more precisely. Fine, I agree with that point too, a blanket statement "preserve Pinsir" is a bad tip, but again you speak in a manner that is completely untenable for good discussion.

All you're doing is pissing people and impressing no one.

 

[P Squared]

GP 1/1

Hide

[OVERVIEW]
* Mega Pinsir is an extremely potent wallbreaker as well as a capable sweeper thanks to an excellent ability in Aerilate, (AC) which bestows it with an excellent Flying-type STAB move coming from base 155 Attack.
* Decent 105 base 105 Speed allows it to outpace a nice portion of the metagame.
* Its modest overall bulk eases setting up. (AP)
* It has access to relatively powerful priority in Quick Attack.
* Its dreadful typing that leaves it weak to common attacking types such as Electric, Ice, and Flying.
* It's also very weak to Stealth Rock, (AC) which can make or break how much Mega Pinsir can do for a team.
* Although it's fast enough to outpace threats such as Garchomp and Genesect, it misses out on quite a few faster ones such as Tapu Koko and Choice Scarf Tyranitar.

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Return
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Close Combat
item: Pinsirite
ability: Hyper Cutter
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
* Swords Dance boosts Mega Pinsir's power into ridiculous levels and allows it to tear through teams and possibly clean up endlate-game.
* Return is a powerful, spammable STAB attack with very few Pokemon that resist it resists.
* Quick Attack is an Aerilate-boosted priority move that hits surprisingly hard after Swords Dance.
* Close Combat offers excellent nuetral neutral coverage alongside Return by hitting Pokemon that resist Flying such as Rotom-W, Celesteela, and Jirachi for substantial damage.

Set Details
========
* Hyper Cutter negates Intimidate's Attack drop before Pinsir Mega Evolving Evolves, (AC) which is helpful for setting up.
* Attack and Speed are maximized to let it hit as hard and fast as possible. Jolly is used to preserve Mega Pinsir's good Speed, notably letting it outpace threats such as Mega Charizard X, Tapu Lele, and Garchomp, but Adamant is an option to hit significantly harder.
* Jolly is useful for outpacing threats such as Mega Charizard X, Tapu Lele, and Garchomp. (see above addition; if there is a problem with this let me know)
* Adamant gives Mega Pinsir bears a good chance to OHKO defensive Landorus-T with a +1 Return after Stealth Rock and an increased probability of OHKOing faster threats such as Genesect and Latios with a +2 Quick Attack. (AP)

Usage Tips
========
* Mega Pinsir should usually be preserved until it's its checks have been sufficiently weakened to sweep.
* If faced with very unfavorable matchups, Mega Pinsir should be used as an early- to mid-game wallbreaker to pave the way for another sweeper to clean up in its wake.
* Be sure Stealth Rock is not on the field before bringing (Mega?) Pinsir into play.

Team Options
========
* Entry hazard removal is crucial, so Defog and Rapid Spin users such as Latios, Tapu Fini, and Starmie are immensely useful.
* Teammates that can deal with Electric-types such as Landorus-T, Amoonguss, and Excadrill are great partners, especially the latter, (AC) as it both sets Stealth Rock and removes them thanks to Rapid Spin.
* Magnezone is a great partner, (AC) as it easily traps then removes Skarmory and Celesteela through by virtue of Magnet Pull and it's its Electric STAB type.
* Powerful wallbreakers that can weaken or outright eliminate it's Mega Pinsir's checks such as Garchomp, Landorus-T, and the aforementioned Magnezone pair very well with it, giving it so it has better chances to sweep.
* Water-types such as Keldeo and the aforementioned Tapu Fini are great teammates, (AC) as they appreciate the pressure Mega Pinsir exerts on bully bulky Grass-types while they can take on threats such as Choice Scarf Tyranitar.
* Healing Wish support from Jirachi or Latias are nice partners that can give Mega Pinsir a second chance to sweep. (AP)

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
* Stone Edge hits Zapdos very hard, but otherwise it has no use.
* Earthquake hits has it's uses such as hitting Jirachi, Mega Metagross, and Chople Berry Steel-types for heavy damage.
* Substitute could be used for a better matchup against bulkier teams.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Zapdos, Rotom-W, and Tapu Koko are examples of Electric-types that can prematurely end Mega Pinsir's rampage through by virtue of their super effective Electric-type STAB attacks. However, only Zapdos has the tools, namely reliable recovery, (reliable recovery) to deal with Mega Pinsir throughout the entire match.

**Skarmory and Celesteela**: Skarmory and Celesteela can potentially wall Mega Pinsir quite easily, (AC) as they resist it's Flying STAB. However, both must be careful, (AC) as they are 2HKOed by +2 Close Combat.

**Faster Attackers**: Faster attackers that aren't KOed by unboosted Quick Attack such as Latios, Mega Aerodactyl, Mega Metagross, Tornadus-T, Choice Scarf Magnezone, and Greninja are huge threats, (AC) as they can easily retaliate with their own strong attacks and potentially KO Mega Pinsir. Choice Scarf Tyranitar and Terrakion also outspeed and OHKO it with their STAB moves. Choice Scarf Tapu Lele deserve an honorable mention, (AC) as it blocks Quick Attack nullifies Quick Attack's priority bracket and can KO Mega Pinsir with Psychic after a bit of prior damage.

**Stealth Rock**: Mega Pinsir abhors Stealth Rock, (AC) as it loses 25% or 25-50% of its health switching in on it in its Stealth Rock in it's base and Mega forme, respectively.

 

[Vague]

i believe this is done !

 

[kumiko]

uploaded

* Be sure Stealth Rock is not on the field before bringing (Mega?) Pinsir into play.

don't cp gp checks pls