Deleted User 400951
Banned deucer.
The thing is, T-tar is ONE MON IN A- (tho imo it's worthy of A). Just one A-ranked mon that - while it does counter, doesn't want to get paralyzed by Discharge - shouldn't entirely negate other, more influential changes that are benefitting Zapdos, such as rain, scarf keldeo, Zard Y and Double Defog. In addition, Zapdos is not designed to break holes or anything in the opposing team. It's designed to be a tank, a Defogger or a sweeper with Agility. In addition, while Zapdos loses to stall because of Chansey and Clefable, it can prevent these mons from switching in and possible scare them out:Zapdos to A.Disagree. Zapdos is certainly a cool Pokémon, but it doesn't need to rise imo. With TTar rising in usage, Zapdos suffers. Zapdos has coverage but generally bulky mons still switch into it without too much issue. I don't think Zapdos should move up or down right now.
-Ferrothorn
-Sp Def Celesteela (even without investment Discharge is a 3hko)
-Toxapex (without investment it's 52% to 2hko which means no switching in)
-Mega Scizor
I'd say that's plenty, isn't it?
Overall, T-tar alone cannot negate Zapdos and while there is plenty of bulky mons that can switch in, Zapdos's wide coverage really reduces that number and lets it handle many bulky threats. I don't think that's enough of a reason to keep it from A.
Other than that, Vertex is just about 100% right with every one of his nominations and I agree with Latias to C+ (though C could also work). Niheligo can also drop. That's it for now. I might update later with more noms.
SOME NOMS:
Mega Manectric to B-: With the opportunity cost rising, this thing has less and less of a place in B. It can't handle T-tar, it just straight-up loses to double defog stall, and rain does have Mega Swampert and Kingdra to just sit there and laugh at it, regardless of whether rain is up. In addition, competition is rising with Mega Gallade, Mega Zard Y and Mega T-tar improving. I don't see this as more effective than Zard X, Azumarill or Mega Shark, and I don't see it on the level of Terrakion, Mega Slowbro, Excadrill or Hoopa-Unbound.
Mimikyu to B-: This tends to only fit on SW, which is falling off rn. While it's still good on TR, TR is not enough to justify this in B any longer.
Mantine to B+: This thing is so useful to have on teams. It walls Zard Y and Volcarona and thus lets teams with it not have to run a >100 scarfer. It also takes on rain very well and can remove hazards for one's team (tho imo it's a bad defogger, it works) while burning mons with Scald. This is nice role compression that IMO deserves a rise.
EDIT FOR POST BELOW:
0 SpA Zapdos Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 252-300 (71.5 - 85.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recoveryZapdos is also useless against Megazard X (bar Discharge Para), Mew, Chansey, Mega Venusaur, Tapu Koko, and Rotom-W off the top of my head.
Without investment/Heat Wave it is sucks against Ferrothorn, Scizor (Normal and Mega), Magearna, and more. It is not a bad mon but if it gets Poisoned it is crippled and certainly has switch-ins. I think Zapdos is nice and cosy in A-, and trying to raise it to the third highest ranking in the list is a bit much.
0 SpA Zapdos Heat Wave vs. 248 HP / 144 SpD Scizor-Mega: 288-340 (83.9 - 99.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
It is useless against AV Magearna but Shift Gear isn't taking it lightly:
0 SpA Zapdos Heat Wave vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Magearna: 146-174 (48.5 - 57.8%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO
And by the way, ZAPDOS ALWAYS CARRIES HEAT WAVE . IDK where you're getting the idea that it doesn't lol. It might not on Defog sets but IMO it should to beat Ferro and besides, those sets are meant for hazard removal, not to beat everything.
Zard X is very rare and imo it just sucks, Chansey as I said beats and Mew does too, Rotom-W is also rather rare in this meta and so is Mega Venu. It's also not meant to beat Koko lol. Normal Scizor is unviable and would likely be ohkoed regardless. And most mons that get poisoned do end up getting pressured lol this is no different for any other mon. And it can have plenty of switch-ins but so does A-ranked ones as well. Seeing this on the level of Chansey, Skarmory and Mega Sableye - stall only mons, Mega Hera which is hot garbage rn and needs to drop, Mega Medi which is terrible vs offense, and Pelipper which is slow and frail isn't right to me. I genuinely do see Zapdos on the level of Mega Mawile, Garchomp, and Toxapex rn.
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