Serious US Election Thread (read post #2014)

[Ajwf]

Red government is here to legislatively erase me and I have no goddamn clue how I'm going to survive it. Until last night, I'd never known the feeling of watching my future crumble to dust before my very eyes. I went from confidence to...let's phrase it as abject hopelessness, even if it was much, much worse than that, in the course of a couple of goddamn hours.

If you were one of the grown-ass people who wrote in Harambe, shame on you. If you wrote in Bernie Sanders after he expressly told people not to do so, shame on you. If you could have taken the time to vote but didn't, no matter what pathetic excuse you may front, shame on you. I'd say this shit in Showdown's scholastic chat as well, but being on college wifi I have the wonders of people who dick around and get banned and thus get me locked for weeks on end. I'd also rage at the fact that we again had to deal with the spoiler effect of third party candidates and their voters, but I suppose Johnson (Pikachu-Beach-Wedding-Officiator-Forme) is just as valid a candidate as any, though the repeated spoiling effect makes me want to see runoff voting more than ever. Also, looking at the map for the 18-24 age group and then seeing that again, that age group had horrid turnout, I again (though for the first time here) pose the question: ELECTION DAY A NATIONAL HOLIDAY WHEN, PEOPLE!? Sorry to get so worked up and abuse the fuck out of formatting but I don't have a future anymore so I have particularly little care for such mores at this point.

I wrote in Sanders. I wouldn't and couldn't vote for someone like Clinton, who I believed had rigged a system against Bernie even when he won the popular vote, who has shown that she cares more about her convenience than the security of American intelligence information through her e-mails, who probably had a hand in the 5-6 'suicides' of people supposed to bring a case before the DNC for election fraud. I wouldn't vote for Trump but I certainly am not crying obnoxious tears over him winning. So yeah, shame on me Mr. High and mighty. Look inward and see the bullshit that your party put us through. The loss is no one but the DNC and Clinton's fault. Should I list it?

• She alienates Sanders voters hard at the DNC, takes away their signs, silences their voices. DWS goes from head of DNC to advisor for Clinton after being shown to be part of the disgusting filth that rigged the primary, essentially spitting in our face.
• She campaigns for the white collared and blue collared workers, college students and 'educated America'. She NEVER tried to appeal to the working class lifeblood of this country like Trump or Sanders. You say "uneducated", I say "working class". Trump destroyed her in this demographic because she couldn't give a shit about people who don't go to college. Also what a fucking travesty you all call Trump out for bigotry and then divide and conquer by class warfare. Did you MISS Bernie's message?
• Oh Miss "I'll unite all Republicans, I can reach across the aisle". What exactly is "Basket of deplorables" and "Irredeemables"? Didn't you learn from "Obama Boys" and "Bernie Bros"? Apparently not. Slander the only people you can win over, get your supporters to shout it down. That worked really well.
• This is the one thing I'm happy about: This bitch was going to sign through the TPP. Again, did you MISS Bernie's message? Worst trade deal that can possibly exist for WORKING CLASS AMERICANS. Forget if it's good overall (it isn't, it's a relationship mess with China+Russia), you just claimed that those working class Americans AGAIN aren't important to you.
• She lost Michigan, a state Obama SAVED. They should've been blue as the deep sea. You know why they weren't? Hey, we saw it in the primary. How can they trust a politician after Flint? How can you trust someone SO UNCARING after your people were literally attacked by politicians for a few extra funds. Bernie/Trump gave a shit. Clinton... looked like the status quo. She lost ALL KINDS OF BLUE STATE from WI, MI, Penn.
• And the demographics you should've worked for? That Keystone pipeline, take a stand against it. You already messed up with TPP. Give Latinos an actual reason to vote for you, not "Trump is big and scary".

This election result is 100% on the DNC and her, and people crying over it have no one to blame but them.You want to know how you can tell? Because we have a republican senate AND congress. Oh, did the independent voters also downticket republican or did your conglomerate just not get off their lazy ass and show up? It's YOUR PARTY'S responsibility to drive that vote. Florida was +1Million on last election and guess what, the Republicans flipped that state

Really, Trump would do well to get some good political advisors in his cabinet. Get some populists who know the system. Specifically, if he could coerce Ron Paul to advise him, it'd be a huge win for this campaign going forward. I'd say Sanders but Sanders wouldn't accept anyways, not out of malice but I think he WILL be filibustering some ideas. The issue with democrats is they act like Republicans are morons. That's probably the primary reason they lost this election. Republicans have run this country more often than the democrats and we always have a centrist leader, regardless of left/right in the election.

I'm sticking in America, I've trusted every president I've been alive under and I still wonder if the Donald we saw yesterday isn't the Trump I've been looking for for two years. What a stupid thing to say, "I'm moving to canada"... you realize that Republicans run this country more often than not, right? It'll be interesting to see if the Republicans try to re-write themselves a bit to try and standardize themselves as the 'party of progress/success' in the next four years.

 

[Aladyyn]

maybe because Hilary was a reasonable candidate and qualified to be President, and Trump wasn't?

If Trump wasn't qualified to be President, they wouldn't let people vote for him

 

[JES]

The election is over, you can stop with the fear mongering

You need to understand the difference between fear mongering and forewarning. Guess you'll see in due time, or we'll find out we had nothing to worry about. It will be one or the other.

 

[manodelrey]

its not the end of the world, but there's a powerful likelihood those things are going to happen. We will have to see how they play out. If what our president promised to do scares you then why on Gods green earth did you vote for him.

who said i voted for him? This election was a choice between the 4 worst people to run for office and its been proven that Hillary was the worst. If Lebron James, Jay-Z, and Beyonce all came together to sell a piece of crap in Ohio, 75% of the population would have bought one. Yet Hillary couldn't win Ohio. How are you not seeing that she was awful? Trump is a racist who was endorsed by the kkk, so why did minorities turn out less to vote for his opponent? Because she is worse than crap.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ed-to-win-over-black-hispanic-and-female-vot/

Quit being salty, its making you look dumber and dumber by the post

 

[Kawaii Kyouko]

maybe because Hilary was a reasonable candidate and qualified to be President, and Trump wasn't?

Is a qualified president supposed to call his/her people "basket of deplorables", "basement-dwellers" or anything like? Shouldn't a qualified president be able to actually handle classified information properly, instead of storing it on a private server as well as revealing some on national TV? Is there even a point to delete a hugeload of emails, doesn't matter if they hold anything or not of note, in an attempt to hide information (useless or not)? Should a president continously blame foreign powers (and a rather huge on at that) for various cases, possibly tipping the power balance? Is a qualified president really dumb enough to push for a no-fly zone over Syria for no other reasons than sticking it to Russia?

Seriously, I'm asking. Trump may be flawed as fuck, but saying Hillary is a qualified person to be a president is just weird with me.

 

[manodelrey]

You need to understand the difference between fear mongering and forewarning. Guess you'll see in due time, or we'll find out we had nothing to worry about. It will be one or the other.

It doesn't feel like forewarning when after every election since I can remember (the 2000 election comes to mind) it's always been the world is going to end, this that and the other thing will be terrible. Then in like a year everything stops and its election season

 

[Texas Cloverleaf]

Seeing a lot of parallels to the Canadian election six years ago when the Conservatives took a majority and the liberals were turfed except there's no NDP to step up and oppose. With any luck we'll see the same outcome in four years, a rejuvenated Liberal party taking a majority over the stale Conservatives

 

[ARandomNoob]

Is a qualified president supposed to call his/her people "basket of deplorables", "basement-dwellers" or anything like? Shouldn't a qualified president be able to actually handle classified information properly, instead of storing it on a private server as well as revealing some on national TV? Is there even a point to delete a hugeload of emails, doesn't matter if they hold anything or not of note, in an attempt to hide information (useless or not)? Should a president continously blame foreign powers (and a rather huge on at that) for various cases, possibly tipping the power balance? Is a qualified president really dumb enough to push for a no-fly zone over Syria for no other reasons than sticking it to Russia?

Seriously, I'm asking. Trump may be flawed as fuck, but saying Hillary is a qualified person to be a president is just weird with me.

I personally use the qualifier "relatively," because if our Presidnet had been up to me, oh hi Jill Stein.

 

[ZoroDark]

can we at least all agree that the idea of having Rudy Giuliani, Sarah Palin, Newt Gingrich and Chris Christie in top cabinet posts is genuinely depressing

 

[Kawaii Kyouko]

I personally use the qualifier "relatively," because if our Presidnet had been up to me, oh hi Jill Stein.

So... what exactly did Hillary have over Trump aside from being a woman and having 30 years of experience (where her accomplishments are very miniscule, as well as doing poorly under Bill's reign). Trump is, as we say in Scandinavia, an air castle currently. Lots of promises, but no real evidence he'll be able to do so. Hillary is the same, just.. well.. she has experience of accomplishing nothing and hiring bad advisors.

 

[Adamant Zoroark]

Hi, so all of this salt re: Clinton supporters blaming Johnson/Stein voters for these results means I gotta chip in

I've decried the spoiler claims before, and I believe the claims that Ralph Nader spoiled the 2000 election to be equally bullshit. I want to get one message across: you are not owed anyone's vote. And even if you have a legitimate basis for claiming third parties spoiled the election, you shouldn't be shaming them for voting that way. You should instead be thinking long and hard about what caused people to cast votes for third-party candidates.

I voted for Gary Johnson (in California, so it's not like it had any effect on the Electoral College). Yes, Gary Johnson was a complete nitwit on anything resembling foreign policy, and anything resembling tax policy. But here's why I voted for him: The two major parties nominated shit for candidates and I had some reason to hate both of them. The Republican Party (which is the party I am registered under) failed to nominate a candidate who looked even slightly sympathetic to the LGBT+ community, and just represented more of failed immigration controls & anti-trade sentiment (history trivia: the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act of 1930 helped worsen the Great Depression, so great fuckin' job you protectionists). On the other hand, the Democratic Party represented big government, and I'm honestly not sure if big government or big business is worse, but they're both shit. I like it when the government is as uninvolved in my life as humanly possible, and Hillary Clinton did not represent that. Basically, if you want me to vote for a major party candidate, they better represent the idea of "Government not spending like crazy and also staying out of my bedroom."

Oh, also, I don't know if it's just me or not, but I know *way* more otherwise-GOP voters than otherwise-Democrat voters who voted for Gary Johnson, so... What rational basis do you have for claiming he was a spoiler, exactly?

 

[EV]

Well, he got one thing right:

"Trump, who for the longest time refused to acknowledge polls in which he was not ahead, acknowledged that he’s losing in some polls—but said there’s “tremendous dishonesty” in the polls these days. The GOP nominee has trailed Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton in nearly every recent national poll, including a CBS News poll released in mid-October that found Clinton leading by 9 points."

 

[ARandomNoob]

So... what exactly did Hillary have over Trump aside from being a woman and having 30 years of experience (where her accomplishments are very miniscule, as well as doing poorly under Bill's reign). Trump is, as we say in Scandinavia, an air castle currently. Lots of promises, but no real evidence he'll be able to do so. Hillary is the same, just.. well.. she has experience of accomplishing nothing and hiring bad advisors.

I mean for me personally, not wanting to force the military to commit war crimes, not nominating a VP who actually believes in conversion therapy, and just generally not wanting to ensure that I have nothing to look forward to but hate and discrimination are just a few things

 

[Soul Fly]

the latest ERB rap battle suddenly isn't funny anymore. help.

 

[ARandomNoob]

With all due respect, fuck this. This delusion that all opinions are equal and we shouldn't complain because "that's how democracy works" is the reason we're in this mess in the first place. No one is saying that we aren't all human, or that people don't have the right to vote however they please. And the only ones who do say that, literal, real-life Nazis, voted for Trump, surprise surprise. If you voted for Trump on how good you think his policy is, you are, at best, kidding yourself, and at worst, you are tacitly supporting every other bit nausea-inducing garbage that's spilled forth from Cheeto Jesus's face. It's for this reason that a vote for Trump, regardless of motivation, is an affront to the human decency that has allowed our society to even come this far to begin with. We can't just throw up our hands and say "You're entitled to your opinion," because guess what? That opinion falls perfectly in line with every white supremacist group in the country. If anything, Trump was the only smart one here, because he took advantage of a vast, untapped market of literal, real-life Nazis, amongst many other flavors of scum that the establishment wasn't willing to blow the dogwhistle hard enough to impress. But where most people saw the final shreds of human decency in the far right, Trump saw an opportunity. What a great businessman, am I right?

Agreed. The idea of "its just an opinion" and the others is one I'll listen to when those opinions don't have actual bodycounts.

 

[ChrystalFalchion]

I bet £1000 (or whatever that is in your currency) that by December of 2017, no wall will be being built between America and Mexico

 

[Kawaii Kyouko]

I mean for me personally, not wanting to force the military to commit war crimes, not nominating a VP who actually believes in conversion therapy, and just generally not wanting to ensure that I have nothing to look forward to but hate and discrimination are just a few things

So by more qualified you mean not-Trump, then? War crimes? What war crimes are you pointing to in Trump's case? To me it's always seemed he want to back off from wars.

I don't know enough about Pence to say anything about him.

I mean, that's alright and all, but I hardly believe that a period of Trump will affect your social justice all that much. The racists will be racist under Hillary as well,the sexists will be sexist under Hillary as well. Unless, of course, she would push for making racist/sexist remarks a crime which is more or less thoughtpolice.




Edit: Just realized how retarded I made the first sentence sound.

 

[JES]

It doesn't feel like forewarning when after every election since I can remember (the 2000 election comes to mind) it's always been the world is going to end, this that and the other thing will be terrible. Then in like a year everything stops and its election season

That is only assuming that policies that are opposed by certain people don't come to pass, or that the results aren't disastrous.

So by more qualified you mean not-Trump, then? War crimes? What war crimes are you pointing to in Trump's case? To me it's always seemed he want to back off from wars.

I don't know enough about Pence to say anything about him.

I mean, that's alright and all, but I hardly believe that a period of Trump will affect your social justice all that much. The racists will be racist under Hillary as well,the sexists will be sexist under Hillary as well. Unless, of course, she would push for making racist/sexist remarks a crime which is more or less thoughtpolice.




Edit: Just realized how retarded I made the first sentence sound.

We'll see. We'll see who Trump and his Regime appoints into what positions. I'm more worried that not only will Trump tolerate violence, he might even say that it's okay, like at his rallies. And that could only be the start.

 

[ARandomNoob]

So by more qualified you mean not-Trump, then? War crimes? What war crimes are you pointing to in Trump's case? To me it's always seemed he want to back off from wars.

I don't know enough about Pence to say anything about him.

I mean, that's alright and all, but I hardly believe that a period of Trump will affect your social justice all that much. The racists will be racist under Hillary as well,the sexists will be sexist under Hillary as well. Unless, of course, she would push for making racist/sexist remarks a crime which is more or less thoughtpolice.




Edit: Just realized how retarded I made the first sentence sound.

That part where he talked about killing terrorists' entire families, including noncombatants, which is, you know, a war crime.

Pence legitimately believes in electroshock conversion therapy (which has been scientifically disproven). That should give you an idea.

Except it's not alright? The Republican legislature is so very socially conservative that we'll have at least some attempts to push back on much of the past few decades of social progress.

 

[Bull Of Heaven]

So by more qualified you mean not-Trump, then? War crimes? What war crimes are you pointing to in Trump's case? To me it's always seemed he want to back off from wars.

 

[Codraroll]

Because a lot of the people who voted for him did it for economic reasons among others. Times are tougher than ever for a lot of people. You can see this in the rust belt where he won states that nobody expected, because a lot of rust belt jobs are going overseas and he's promised to bring them back.

A lot of the Rust Belt jobs are, for the lack of a better term, screwed over by progress. All the steel jobs came because the US was the only country in its economic hemisphere with a large-scale steel industry for several decades. There were no cheaper steel suppliers on the market than those mills in Ohio and Pennsylvania and Michigan and wherever. But then China, Japan, India and others figured out how to make steel, cheaply, in large volumes, and sold to an ever-expanding market that includes the US. The Midwestern steel mills were out-competed by places like Shenzen and, Bangalore and Tianjin. What does these people think Trump can do? Make the rest of the world forget how to make steel again?

Or cars? Simply put, traditional American cars are gas guzzlers with shoddy build quality. The Japanese, Koreans and Germans beat Ford and Chrysler out of overseas markets. Do people think Trump will somehow executively order the rest of the world to lower their cars' build quality, so the Midwestern car factories can be top of the line again?

Mining jobs, even worse. If the voters think Trump can make the world forget solar and nuclear energy so that US coal can be profitable again, good luck to them. It is possible to make coal profitable by subsidies and tax exemptions, but with Swanson's Law progressing the way it does, coal won't stay competitive for many more years. Plus, they're screwing over the climate, which to be fair neither Trump nor his voters care anything about.


But yeah, a lot of the Rust Belt is effectively dead unless they find a new industry to compete in. Trump can't turn back the clock to the days of US industrial hegemony, and it shouldn't take a genius to figure that out. I guess isolationism and high toll barriers could make US steel, cars or coal the cheapest option for the US market itself, but then it would lose all traces of competitiveness overseas. He could perhaps find something else for the Midwest to live off of, but that wouldn't help the people with specialization in the outdated industries.

 

[cookie]

I'm glad Trump won. Precisely because of how terrible he will be as POTUS. The DNC were unwilling to change their corrupt ways, and the elite elsewhere did not listen to the masses. Well this is what you get. The trend across the world is the ruling classes and corporations who have gotten used to less and less accountability, but that will change. Trump will worsen income inequality, destroying the well-being of millions of Americans - while cutting taxes to the rich. He's also going to let Russia wreak havoc in Europe. If this continues something will give.

I'm shocked that millions of people did not learn from history and voted a fascist populist - we've failed as a society to have let this happen. Every person we insulted for voting Trump/Brexit, rather than engaging with them, has failed society, every bit as much as those who voted for it. You can get on your high horse all you want for being anti-Trump but we live in a society, it's our job as a whole to make sure this shit doesn't happen.

This is our punishment for letting history repeat itself, though it will only be punishment if we continue to let it.

 

[Kawaii Kyouko]

We'll see. We'll see who Trump and his Regime appoints into what positions. I'm more worried that not only will Trump tolerate violence, he might even say that it's okay, like at his rallies. And that could only be the start.

We'll see. Yes, exactly. That's what I'm trying to say. We don't know yet. No one does. Absolutely no one. So how can one suddenly start screaming like yet another doomsayer?

That part where he talked about killing terrorists' entire families, including noncombatants, which is, you know, a war crime.

Pence legitimately believes in electroshock conversion therapy (which has been scientifically disproven). That should give you an idea.

Except it's not alright? The Republican legislature is so very socially conservative that we'll have at least some attempts to push back on much of the past few decades of social progress.

Oh, yes, rallying people. Sometimes people overexaggerate to create excitement. Does not mean he's actually going to do it. If he does, well fuck me I got fooled.

Alright, I'll give you that.

I don't know, I work in trades. A construction worker if you will. I call my apprentices all kinds of homophobic, racist, sexist and horrific slurs whenever they fuck up. But in our field, it's just banter. I call my muslim co-workers for ali baba and muhmmad, my bisexual coworker for "homsefaen" (gay fuck), my black co-worker for (BAN ME PLEASE). And in return they all call me for fuckface. It's our culture, and we want to keep it that way no matter how painful it is.

 

[Bogmire]

With all due respect, fuck this. This delusion that all opinions are equal and we shouldn't complain because "that's how democracy works" is the reason we're in this mess in the first place. No one is saying that we aren't all human, or that people don't have the right to vote however they please. And the only ones who do say that, literal, real-life Nazis, voted for Trump, surprise surprise. If you voted for Trump on how good you think his policy is, you are, at best, kidding yourself, and at worst, you are tacitly supporting every other bit nausea-inducing garbage that's spilled forth from Cheeto Jesus's face. It's for this reason that a vote for Trump, regardless of motivation, is an affront to the human decency that has allowed our society to even come this far to begin with. We can't just throw up our hands and say "You're entitled to your opinion," because guess what? That opinion falls perfectly in line with every white supremacist group in the country. If anything, Trump was the only smart one here, because he took advantage of a vast, untapped market of literal, real-life Nazis, amongst many other flavors of scum that the establishment wasn't willing to blow the dogwhistle hard enough to impress. If you knew me, you'd know that I am extremely cautious about whipping out Nazi comparisons, because if they're abused the way they do commonly are, you're failing to do justice to one of the biggest atrocities in human history. But I don't even have to make comparisons here. Literal, real-life Nazis openly stood with this guy. Where most people saw the final shreds of human decency in the far right, Trump saw an opportunity. What a great businessman, am I right?

lol this is satire, right? Get a grip.

 

[Codraroll]

War crimes? What war crimes are you pointing to in Trump's case?

Let's see:

"We have to take out their families" is a famous one.

"[Waterboarding] I like it a lot" - you know, torture!

But as if that wasn't enough: "I'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding"

Of course, this is illegal and war crimes. But there is a simple solution, according to our friend Donald: Make it legal!

But... won't the soldiers of the US military have objections against violating the Geneva convention? You know, at Nüremberg it was established that "just following orders" won't help a soldier in a court of law. "If I say do it, they're going to do it", Trump says. Coercing soldiers to commit war crimes is a war crime in itself.

And now this guy is getting the nuclear launch codes. Good thing he has woved to be cautious and careful with thos-

...just kidding, nukes are no big deal and the US should totally drop a few.